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ex-lucy
07-09-06, 13:09
ball goes dead.
Different ball comes onto pitch.
black pass ball along 22m to nr left touch and black kicker kicks to himself a short distance.

Rf says: "No, not with a new ball. No quick drop outs with a new ball. Normal kick please" (or something like that)

Black 10 kicks long ...

I cant find this in the laws ... anyone know what Chris White was appertaining to?

Deeps
07-09-06, 13:09
Sounds like 'fair play' and prevention of 'unsportsmanlike behaviour' to me. Was he managing the fact that the opposition had seen the old ball go off in one direction and should not therefore, under fair play, be surprised by a quick drop out from a new ball snuck on from the other side of the pitch? Similar in fact to quick throw ins needing to be the same ball, untouched by another person etc.

In tennis the gesture of the 'new' balls being shown by the server to his opponent is observed. Perhaps CW was alluding to the need for a similar fair play approach by dwelling a respectable pause to indicate that a new ball had come on before taking the drop out?

Simon Thomas
07-09-06, 14:09
I can recall seeing a document about this but can't recall if it was IRB, RFU, National Panel protocol or whatever.

This said exactly what Deeps alludes to and states only if same ball is used can quick throw (in law) be taken, so apply same to 22 drop out, quick penalty, restart etc

Neeed
07-09-06, 18:09
Law 2.6 Spare Balls
Spare balls may be available during a match, but a team may not gain or attempt to gain unfair advantage by using them or changing balls.

Maybe the Ref saw that the ball was being used to gain advantage unfairly. I would think that if a team sees a ball go out, they would expect some effort to recover the ball before a spare is given.

Ned

didds
07-09-06, 22:09
depends on how long it took black to "pass ball along 22m to nr left touch" really surely?


e.g. If the ball came on to the right, and got passed the entire width of the field slowly, then frankly play on. Keep the game moving!

didds

Deeps
07-09-06, 22:09
Law 2.6 Spare Balls
Spare balls may be available during a match, but a team may not gain or attempt to gain unfair advantage by using them or changing balls.


Now there's one I have not read for a while, well spotted Ned.

Neeed
08-09-06, 20:09
It's one of the benefits of being new. Reviewing for that exam made the rules run through my dreams.

Deeps
09-09-06, 00:09
It's one of the benefits of being new. Reviewing for that exam made the rules run through my dreams.

After a while, much of the law becomes instinctive though it is sensible to pick up the book now and again to read through some of the more obscure laws like this one. Some of us rely on some like you to give us a nudge now and again.

Mike Whittaker
09-09-06, 08:09
After a while, much of the law becomes instinctive though it is sensible to pick up the book now and again to read through some of the more obscure laws like this one. Some of us rely on some like you to give us a nudge now and again.


Which is why as an assessor I hardly ever discuss law with the ref... He usually knows it better than my instinct.

(Fortunately there are always loads of other things on which I can take his game to pieces so no problem there :D )

SONA
11-09-06, 11:09
(Fortunately there are always loads of other things on which I can take his game to pieces so no problem there :D )

:eek:
Ouch!:D

A shot straight through the heart.

Number8
19-09-06, 22:09
It's one of the benefits of being new. Reviewing for that exam made the rules run through my dreams.

Laws, man, Laws of the Game!
(Someone had an interesting explication of the difference between 'laws' and 'rules', if only I could remember where I saw it...)

Mike Whittaker
20-09-06, 06:09
Laws, man, Laws of the Game!
(Someone had an interesting explication of the difference between 'laws' and 'rules', if only I could remember where I saw it...)

Probably as subtle as the difference between explain and explicate...?

For me a rule is there for guidance and a law for interpretation. But then it depends from which side you are looking. :)

Neeed
20-09-06, 18:09
This is a definition of the word Rule:

Law.
a. a formal order or direction made by a court, as for governing the procedure of the court (general rule) or for sending the case before a referee (special rule).
b. a legal principle.
c. a court order in a particular case.

And here is Law:

the principles and regulations established in a community by some authority and applicable to its people, whether in the form of legislation or of custom and policies recognized and enforced by judicial decision.

Me fail english? That's unpossible!