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crossref
31-03-11, 14:03
That seems qualitatively different to that which we were discussing. I would suggest that you stop trying to equate all these things and come up with a unified theory of what's allowed, and concentrate rather on applying good judgement, involving ALL the factors at the time.


A possible unified theory is


- a player may not take any action off the FoP to prevent opponents taking a quick throw

Another unified theory is


- a player taking ball into touch must release it to allow a QT (in Laws)
- other players from the same team are then free to play the ball in order to prevent the QT


It's a genuine question ? Are you allowed to touch the ball simply to stop the possibility of a QT?

SimonSmith
31-03-11, 15:03
Conduct unbecoming a gentleman.

PK

crossref
31-03-11, 15:03
or - quick thinking, fair play ?

Davet
31-03-11, 16:03
Members of Parliament are supposedly the exemplars of Gentlemen - so I'm sure that there is much, short of murdering ones granny, that actually qualifies as ungentlemanly conduct.

Using a procedural device to disadvantge the opposition would not be a problem.

OB..
31-03-11, 18:03
Are you allowed to touch the ball simply to stop the possibility of a QT?
Why not? Provided you do so fairly ie don't grab it from an opponent or barge him out of the way etc. Just picking it up if you arrive there first seems perfectly legal to me.

andyscott
31-03-11, 18:03
It's a genuine question ? Are you allowed to touch the ball simply to stop the possibility of a QT?

no denying the opportunity, PK on the 15 ;)

1st time probably an ear bending only, then PK them.

OB..
31-03-11, 18:03
no denying the opportunity, PK on the 15 ;)

1st time probably an ear bending only, then PK them.

What law are you using?

andybzoso
31-03-11, 20:03
What law are you using?

Might be slightly off on a tangent with this one but....

If there is the opportunity for a quick throw and a player crosses the line of touch to touch the ball and prevent it does that player find himself liable to penalty under the following, and if so what sanction?

(g) At a quick throw-in, a player may come to the line of touch and leave without being penalised.

Personally I'd be thinking acts contrary to good sportsmanship or misconduct while ball out of play (latter on the grounds that they are obstructing an opponent) but thought that the one about coming to the line would be an interesting one to look at.....

I'll get my coat... :norc:

crossref
31-03-11, 20:03
another thing then where experienced refs fall into two camps.

andybzoso
31-03-11, 20:03
another thing then where experienced refs fall into two camps.

Or make it up as they go along.... :rolleyes:

only kidding!!! honest.... :swet:

chbg
31-03-11, 22:03
If you can get to the ball first, fairly, then you may touch it to prevent a QT. If, having carried it over, you don't release it to the opposition; or you barge them, stop them getting to the ball, (or stand within the tramlines to prevent a QT) then you are penalisable.

Does 'release to the opposition so that there can be a QT' mean let go of the ball immediately even if there is no opposition actively wanting the ball? Very gentlemanly/ladylike, but reasonable?

crossref
31-03-11, 22:03
it's interesting.
- If the ball carrier throws the ball away = PK
- if ball carrier drops ball on ground and team mate kicks it away = good play

Rit Hinners
31-03-11, 22:03
How about handing the ball to the ball boy?

Davet
31-03-11, 22:03
it's interesting.
- If the ball carrier throws the ball away = PK
- if ball carrier drops ball on ground and team mate kicks it away = good play

No, both bad and penalisable.

But simply touching or placing the ball is not a problem - it's the throwing away that creates the problem.

Mickman
31-03-11, 23:03
How about handing the ball to the ball boy?

Very clever :clap: or even an early arriving referee? or linesman at lower levels where there aren't ball boys...

menace
01-04-11, 03:04
How about handing the ball to the ball boy?

or just throw the ball boy(s) a few quid and a gatorade to always touch the ball when it's not your teams potential QT. :biggrin: :biggrin:

Casey Bee
01-04-11, 03:04
I'm suddenly reminded of a situation I saw - A potential QT could have been taken, red player had the ball in hand and could have thrown. A 'defending' black team player ran up and touched the ball that was in red player's hands and announced 'you can't take a quick one'.
What does anybody think of that?

dave_clark
01-04-11, 08:04
manage it :biggrin:

GeorgeR
01-04-11, 08:04
it's interesting.
- If the ball carrier throws the ball away = PK
- if ball carrier drops ball on ground and team mate kicks it away = good play

The team mate doesnt even ned to kick it away the QT is disallowed if another player touches the ball other than the player taking it out Law 19.2 d

Davet
01-04-11, 08:04
I'm suddenly reminded of a situation I saw - A potential QT could have been taken, red player had the ball in hand and could have thrown. A 'defending' black team player ran up and touched the ball that was in red player's hands and announced 'you can't take a quick one'.
What does anybody think of that?

If the opponent stands in the tramlines and blocks the throw then FK against him, if he is even closer than in the tramlines then FK against him.

I don't think we want to penalise players preventing the quick throw per se, but doing it by acting like a 12 year old who thinks he's clever can create a flashpoint and requires managing - which can include FK or PK sanctions, or cards.... each case on it's merits.