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Browner
16-11-14, 17:11
http://www.irblaws.com/index.php?domain=10&year=2014&clarification=1004

Looks like IRB have indirectly overruled 16.3(a) & (c)

menace
17-11-14, 00:11
Agree but it looks like we have to conform with

"Therefore body rolls are permissible but head rolls should be penalised."

So long as the body roll is away from the ruck then all is accepted....as for endeavouring to stay on your feet, then the word 'endeavour' must have new meaning since I went to school. :shrug:

I'm sure as soon as a player receives a dislocated disc from the rotating body roll action then it might be reviewed. :chair:

Ian_Cook
17-11-14, 02:11
Initially, I was not happy with the idea of saddle/gator rolls because I saw it as collapsing the ruck but I have been convinced over the last season or two that it is a good way to expose the ball. For me collapsing the ruck means dragging the ruck players down on top of the ball/other players in such a way that it kills the ball and/or endangers players on the ground who have been unable to roll away.

I don't see any problems with it so long as it meets those last two criteria, i.e. that it is done by rolling the player away from the ruck/tackle, and not in a manner that endangers other players or the player being rolled away. However, for this last reason, I am still not convinced that saddle/gator rolls should be allowed at junior levels where there can be a huge disparity in strength between players.

OB..
17-11-14, 13:11
Initially, I was not happy with the idea of saddle/gator rolls because I saw it as collapsing the ruck but I have been convinced over the last season or two that it is a good way to expose the ball. For me collapsing the ruck means dragging the ruck players down on top of the ball/other players in such a way that it kills the ball and/or endangers players on the ground who have been unable to roll away.

I don't see any problems with it so long as it meets those last two criteria, i.e. that it is done by rolling the player away from the ruck/tackle, and not in a manner that endangers other players or the player being rolled away. However, for this last reason, I am still not convinced that saddle/gator rolls should be allowed at junior levels where there can be a huge disparity in strength between players.I agree. It is important to be clear that even a legal action can become illegal if done dangerously.

Dave Sherwin
07-01-15, 18:01
Interesting discussion last night on this Law Clarification, especially in the light of the way that rucks in the Sevens series seem to be being refereed. The suggestion was (as I note was posited in previous threads on this matter) that a saddle roll was only ok where the player being rolled was in manual contact with the ball (thus properly constituting a "clearout", which is the word used in the clarification. Where the player being rolled is simply a rucker (ie no manual contact with the ball) this would still constitute collapsing of the ruck/dangerous play. Whilst I appreciate that there are diverse (and valid) opinions on this, I am hoping that someone in possession of a "secret email" or directive in another form from the RFU or equivalent can confirm. The USA GMG (the only sort of "official" documentation on this to which I currently have access) are quite explicit that on players who are "on their feet with their hands on the ball" may be rolled.