PDA

View Full Version : Law Trials - 15 Tackle



ChrisR
05-01-16, 17:01
Law 15 - Tackle

1. The tackler must get up before playing the ball and then may only play the ball from behind his side of the breakdown mid-point. (amend current 15.4 (c). The breakdown mid-point is not the ball but the point where players are in contact.

2. A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once (existing 15.5 (b)

3. If Tackler and Ball carrier only then there is no breakdown or offside line this is open play and subsequent attacking players maybe be tackled by retreating players

4. Recognize Assist Tackler in Law
Players in opposition to the ball carrier who remain on their feet who bring the ball carrier to ground so that the player is tackled must clearly release the ball and the ball carrier immediately after the tackled player is put on the ground. Those players may then play the ball providing they are on their feet and do so from behind the breakdown mid-point (Existing 15.6 (c)

ChrisR
05-01-16, 18:01
1. The tackler must get up before playing the ball and then may only play the ball from behind his side of the breakdown mid-point. (amend current 15.4 (c). The breakdown mid-point is not the ball but the point where players are in contact.

This cleans up the tackle a bit as everyone has to get on the right side of the tackle before going for the ball. I like defining the mid-point as the contact point between BC & tackler instead of the ball except after the tackler releases that point is now gone virtual..

2. A tackled player must immediately pass the ball or release it. That player must also get up or move away from it at once (existing 15.5 (b)

Hahahahahaha! Yes, it's existing but unless the BC holds on when contested it never gets called. I agree that most of the time the BC is buried under bodies almost immediately. However, with the introduction of the 'breakdown' and the requirement for an opponent who gets hands to the ball to immediately release when the BC support arrives will pretty much eliminate poaching at the breakdown.

3. If Tackler and Ball carrier only then there is no breakdown or offside line – this is open play and subsequent attacking players maybe be tackled by retreating players

A third player from the defending side going over the ball doesn't create a breakdown. If the first BC support player picks up the ball instead of crouching over it then he is lable to be tackled by retreating players as a breakdown wasn't set.

4. Recognize Assist Tackler in Law
Players in opposition to the ball carrier who remain on their feet who bring the ball carrier to ground so that the player is tackled must clearly release the ball and the ball carrier immediately after the tackled player is put on the ground. Those players may then play the ball providing they are on their feet and do so from behind the breakdown mid-point (Existing 15.6 (c)

Not the same as the old 15.6(c) which required the tackling player to be goalside of the ball and to come thru the 'gate'. After the tackler releases the BC the mid-point becomes imaginary.

crossref
05-01-16, 19:01
3. If Tackler and Ball carrier only then there is no breakdown or offside line this is open play and subsequent attacking players maybe be tackled by retreating players

is same as now.

The difference will be when the supporting player arrives, stands over the ball for a second, creating offside lines, and then picks it and runs with it. Every retreating opponent behind him is offside, so he can run 5m before any retreating player is played onside and can tackle him.
<repeat>

Dixie
06-01-16, 13:01
This provision suffers from the uncertainties over the breakdown that we are discussing elsewhere. For example:

Law 15 - Tackle

1. The tackler must get up before playing the ball and then may only play the ball from behind his side of the breakdown mid-point. (amend current 15.4 (c). The breakdown mid-point is not the ball but the point where players are in contact.

So what does he do if no breakdown has formed as yet? Presumably, he is unable to play the ball - so the old option of releasing, getting to feet and picking up before a 3rd party arrives at the tackle is no longer possible? Equally, if the breakdown has been formed by an attacker taking a strong stance above the ball, where is the mid-point? It's defined as the point of contact with other players, so where there are no other players there is no mid-point, so he can't join? Should we insist on a better 12 year-old?

3. If Tackler and Ball carrier only then there is no breakdown or offside line – this is open play and subsequent attacking players maybe be tackled by retreating players This is just drivel. A breakdown is defined as the arrival of an attacking player over the ball. How does an attacker get to pick up the ball without first arriving at it - thereby creating offside lines? If he's picked it up, he arrived, thus creating a breakdown and the associated offside lines.

4. Recognize Assist Tackler in Law
Players in opposition to the ball carrier who remain on their feet who bring the ball carrier to ground so that the player is tackled must clearly release the ball and the ball carrier immediately after the tackled player is put on the ground. Those players may then play the ball providing they are on their feet and do so from behind the breakdown mid-point (Existing 15.6 (c))

Again, there may be no breakdown. As Tackle Assist, their presence over the ball does not create a breakdown - that is reserved to the Attacking Team, by which we guess the 12 year-old means the ball carrying team. So the Tackle Assist cannot jackal for the ball - though it's unclear whether a newly-arriving team can do so. If the Tackle Assist waits for the arrival of an oppo to set up the Breakdown, he can't then handle the ball. If he doesn't wait, he can't handle the ball because he's not at a breakdown.

ChrisR
06-01-16, 14:01
From crossref:

The difference will be when the supporting player arrives, stands over the ball for a second, creating offside lines, and then picks it and runs with it.

If the first BC support player crouches over the ball he creates a 'breakdown'. From the trial Law 16:

2. Only players acting as a half-back can play the ball with their hands (lift the ball out of the breakdown). They must be on their feet and on-side. They must subsequently run, pass or kick. (New 16.2 – Joining a breakdown). A half-back is any one player who is not part of the breakdown and behind the hindmost foot who is in a position to play the ball emerging from the breakdown. The hindmost foot will be the offside line for half-back players.

So, once a BC support player is over the ball he is part of the breakdown and can't pick up the ball. Can he leave the breakdown and pick it up? Not in any practical sense.

crossref
06-01-16, 15:01
So, once a BC support player is over the ball he is part of the breakdown and can't pick up the ball. Can he leave the breakdown and pick it up? Not in any practical sense.

it's a nice idea but the draft Law doesn't say that, and I don't think that's what they intend, otherwise it would be simply impossible for the supporting player to ever pick up the ball, as to pick it up he'd have to momentarily create a breakdown first

ChrisR
06-01-16, 16:01
it's a nice idea but the draft Law doesn't say that, and I don't think that's what they intend, otherwise it would be simply impossible for the supporting player to ever pick up the ball, as to pick it up he'd have to momentarily create a breakdown first

I think the distinction has to be made in law. An approaching support player must chose to pick up the ball "immediately" or set the breakdown. I question whether the referee has to call "breakdown" every time to signal the start.

crossref
06-01-16, 16:01
well, I'll guess we'll see when the trial starts -- and I think the wording will be tightened up before the trial.

ChrisR
06-01-16, 16:01
Not gonna be our problem this Spring!