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ChrisR
15-03-16, 04:03
I had great WiFi access this past weekend so binge-watched the Vancouver 7s.

I saw pretty much the entire 2nd day so I'm not totally sure of the exact details but ....

Player under pressure hoofs the ball from near his own 22 and it rolls into the opponents in-goal. It is still moving when a defender (Kaka?) puts one foot over the dead ball line and grounds the ball. I'm quite sure he didn't pick it up so it should have been a touch down.

Instead of the 22 he was awarded a scrum from where it was kicked.

Applicable laws:

22.5(b) Player in touch or touch-in-goal. If defending players are in touch-in-goal, they can make a touch down by grounding the ball in their in-goal provided they are not carrying the ball.

22.9(e) If a player with one or both feet on or behind the dead ball line picks up the ball, which was in motion within in-goal, that player has picked up the ball outside the playing area.

beckett50
15-03-16, 08:03
Not quite sure what your question here is Marauder?

The payer made the ball dead - by having a foot over the dead ball line - whilst it was still in motion and so the award of a scrum back from where the ball was kicked is the correct decision.

Ian_Cook
15-03-16, 08:03
22.8 BALL KICKED DEAD THROUGH IN-GOAL
If a team kicks the ball through their opponents’ in-goal into touch-in-goal or on or over the
dead ball line, except by an unsuccessful kick at goal or attempted dropped goal, the
defending team has two choices:
• To have a drop-out, or
• To have a scrum at the place where the ball was kicked and they throw in.

Now the question to be asked is, does a player grounding the ball with one or both feet over the dead ball line (or TiG) count as puting the ball through in goal?

I think you are right. Since a player with his feet in touch or TiG can score I try. To me, that means a player ground that ball this way is not putting the ball over the DBL/TiG; he's making the ball dead, so 22DO is the only option.

I didn't see that match (I don't watch sevens all that much) however I did watch a replay of the final, and the same thing happened; a NZ player kicked the ball, and one of the South Africans poked a toe over the DBL and grounded the ball. Ref offered options

Ian_Cook
15-03-16, 08:03
Not quite sure what your question here is Marauder?

The payer made the ball dead - by having a foot over the dead ball line - whilst it was still in motion and so the award of a scrum back from where the ball was kicked is the correct decision.


Technically, he is grounding the ball, not putting it into TiG or over the DBL. That is the difference between 22.5 (b) and 22.9 (e) as Marauder points out.

Law 22.8 clearly states that the ball has to be put dead in goal or touch in goal to get the options. Grounded in goal is neither of these. If there is not meant to be a difference, then why do these two laws treat the two situations differently.

Phil E
15-03-16, 09:03
Having a foot over or on the line only matters if you pick the ball up. Which the player didn't, he just grounded it.

Misunderstanding of the law by the player I think.

22DO should have been the decision.

Taff
15-03-16, 09:03
This scrum back option only applies if the ball is kicked through in goal.

This ball was grounded in goal. If the defender wanted the scrum back option, he should've picked up the ball while it was still moving with his foot over the DBL.

ChrisR
15-03-16, 11:03
Yes, Ian, that's the incident. The ball wasn't going to make it to the dead ball line so he had the right idea. Just hadn't read the small print and neither had somebody else.

didds
15-03-16, 12:03
Not quite sure what your question here is Marauder?

The payer made the ball dead - by having a foot over the dead ball line - whilst it was still in motion and so the award of a scrum back from where the ball was kicked is the correct decision.


But he didn't pick it up to make it dead outside of the dead-ball line 22.9(e).

Surely by touching down and not picking the ball up the ball hasn;t legt the in-goal area?

I'd be quite happy though to simplify matters here and accept that is now a dead ball behind the dbl!

didds

Haven;t we discussed this before.

didds
15-03-16, 12:03
Misunderstanding of the law by the player I think.



and clearly the referee also.

didds