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Robert Burns
24-02-06, 03:02
We are back,

Pleas copy any posts from the temp forums by 10 March,

Due to the numbering system used by the forums they cannot be done without manually doing them.

OB..
24-02-06, 13:02
ˇOlé! :D :D :D :D :D

Simon Thomas
24-02-06, 14:02
hurrah - at last ! Well done Rob

Simon Griffiths
24-02-06, 17:02
Well done, good to be back, I was feeling a bit lonely without this place... (well, slight exaggeration). Can't say that I used the temporary forums, so I'll be back with a vengeance!

ExHookah
24-02-06, 20:02
Hurrah!

Welcome back everyone!

Deeps
25-02-06, 10:02
Good effort Robert, nice to be back.

Mike Whittaker
26-02-06, 19:02
Just have to think of something to say.... But a ref lost for words is very rare..

Mike Whittaker
26-02-06, 19:02
Just have to think of something to say.... But a ref lost for words is very rare..


However an assessor lost for words is not quite so rare...

AndyKidd
26-02-06, 20:02
<~~~~~ walks in looks around ........ "have you redecorated" :)

Robert Burns
02-03-06, 11:03
Sorry about the downtime again, but we found that the upgrade left some huge holes in the system that could have been security risks to the server.

Got them fixed.

As you'll see post bits (part on left) are coming back slowly, getting there guys!
Thanks for patience again, it's been as frustrating for me lately as it has for you, hopefully now you can enjoy the reliablility we had before.

OB..
02-03-06, 14:03
ˇOlé!

(I'll whisper this time, so I don't disturb the system.)

ExHookah
02-03-06, 14:03
<< Tip toes in, trys not to touch anything fragile.....>>

Welcome back again everyone. Maybe I don't have to do so much "work" now this is back.

Mike Whittaker
02-03-06, 18:03
well it all looks fine.... but I promise not to say anything controversial for a few days... (truth is I am off on holiday anyway....)

Let me just ask all referees if you always complete a feedback form for your assessor? And how would you expect an assessor to grade you next time if you didn't??? :D

Robert Burns
02-03-06, 23:03
What feedback form for the assessor?

Mike Whittaker
02-03-06, 23:03
What feedback form for the assessor?

In this part of the world it is usual for the ref to complete a feedback form on the assessment. This goes to the SADO to help in the development of the assessment process.

Group refs (level 5) are required to do this.

If you want to see the form it is on the Hants refs web site, which I am sure you can find easily.

PS ... some of the refs don't bother... usually the ones who complain about assessors!!!

Deeps
03-03-06, 00:03
One training meeting our SADO explained how short we were of assessors and that they were invariably busy working with exchange referees. Accordingly, anyone not then being 'fast tracked' would be doing well to be seen twice per season by the assessment team. Accordingly, it was important that each referee deposit a feedback card with the two team captains after a game so that trends in an individual's performance could be established. He explained that it was important to get these cards in, even if you had suffered a dreadful game, for the returned cards could indicate which referees needed help with a particular issue and not to worry as blips in a normal run of games could easily be spotted and disregarded. In addition, such was the SADO's knowledge and experience of individual clubs and teams that appropriate weighting could be applied where necessary.

A long explanation I know but since then I have religiously handed out 'referee encouragement forms' as I call them on each occasion, sometimes hiding gritted teeth with a forced smile. The results have been surprising; occasions where I thought I had a good game resulted in low scores, conversely some that I thought were a little beyond my reach were scored highly. How on earth the SADO spots trends from some widely diverging scores, from the same game in many instances, is beyond me.

Yes, I do want to know where my performance as a referee needs attention. I also like to be flattered occasionally; I like to think the customer is satisfied with my performance. There are also times when I think league positions should be decided less by the score and more by comments I and my colleagues may wish to make from time to time on the behaviour, attitude and performance of teams. Yet there is one thing that really gets right up my nose and that is when a skipper fails to send in a feedback form yet has taken every opportunity on the field to tell me where I am falling short of his expectations. This really hacks me off and is the second thing I mention when I next referee that team.

Yes Mike, on the very few yet very welcome occasions when you or one of the assessment team make an effort to help me with my game and buy the beer afterwards as you all do, I return an assessor feedback form because I want you guys to know that (1) I appreciate it and (2) its a real bummer if nobody bothers.

Mike Whittaker
03-03-06, 09:03
One training meeting our SADO explained how short we were of assessors and that they were invariably busy working with exchange referees. Accordingly, anyone not then being 'fast tracked' would be doing well to be seen twice per season by the assessment team.

The following is a personal view and in no way intended to reflect the views of any others...

As I see it Deeps, the Society referees fall into 3 categories..

1. Those destined for higher things i.e. Group and above (level 5)
2. Those who need help to achieve a level of competence acceptable at level 10. i.e. those who can then be considered safe in the lower levels of the county.
3. Those in the 9 - 6 range who are destined to remain in that range because of age, ability, ambition etc.

Given the limited adviser/assessor resource you can guess which of the above 3 gets least attention. I am not saying this is fair, but then life isn't fair! At least the card system does assist in identifying those who fit in cases 1 and 2.

Where I would like to see some more advice being given is from refs who are not doing games. Each week there are refs out for injury reasons or cancellations and they should all be watching a game with a ref who would like comment. The SADO does provide training to any ref wanting to learn the principles of advising, and I for one have frequently offered to take a ref with me when I am doing an assessment to explain what we look for... you can guess how often this is taken up.

There is no easy solution and many refs will remain unhappy that they have not been able to develop to the level they would like to, and it is no consolation to be told that there is far more advice around now than there was 25 years ago. And of course there are those who just ain't as good as they like to think they are.... (not thinking of you here Deeps! but you know as well as I do from the comments that get made....)

Personally I am having this weekend off... getting saturated with watching! Have a good one everyone, wherever it is. :)

OB..
03-03-06, 12:03
Mike - I wholeheartedly agree.
I have already pinched a copy of your feedback form to suggest to my society.

Where I would like to see some more advice being given is from refs who are not doing games.I recently bumped into one of our referees doing a stint advising while injured, and he reckoned he was getting a lot out of it as a referee - seeing others at work, and being forced to analyse what was happening in a different way.
When I proposed to our committee that we should (almost) expect unappointed/injured referees to do some advising, they expressed considerable caution. As long as referees have the right to opt out, I see no real problem. What do you referees think?

Simon Thomas
03-03-06, 13:03
OB - I will send Gloucester Society an invoice for use of the Hampshire Advisor Feedback Form. How many referees in your Society ? Hee hee - joking !

On a more serious note :

I reviewed the Club cards for our members recently. The contrast was amazing - some members had almost all games they did covered by club cards, whereas others had only a few cards returned and in some cases none at all ! All from the same range of clubs - interesting ! Often the club / skipper apathy is blamed, so how do they send back one referee's cards and not another - I wonder ? Yes there are widely differing scores from different clus anbd teams, and we are trying to address that. The skipper response is based on 'customer feedback' not a trained assessor and CBRDS elements. At the Grading Commitee meeting any referee is less likely to have an upgrade supported without club card evidence.


It is Hampshire policy that all our Development Squad referees should take the Advisor Course. It used to be levels 1 and 2, and now we are running the new RFU course that we piloted for Andy Melrose.
When injured / afternoon off, they can be added (not forced) to assist the small band of Society Advisors struggling to cover all the exchange / development squad / regular members (but one is an IRB advisor and two are South West Group Advisors so aren't available for our own referees). This season almost all active members (70) have been watched at least once, and all those 'with potential' twice or more - well done the advisor team, who are consistent in their analysis and attend four training meetings on Saturday mornings a season as well as the monthly Society one !

On personal note, being a level 2 Advisor when injured, or not appointed, has greatly assisted my own refereeing performance.

ExHookah
03-03-06, 14:03
Where I would like to see some more advice being given is from refs who are not doing games. Each week there are refs out for injury reasons or cancellations and they should all be watching a game with a ref who would like comment. The SADO does provide training to any ref wanting to learn the principles of advising, and I for one have frequently offered to take a ref with me when I am doing an assessment to explain what we look for... you can guess how often this is taken up.

A number of us in New England (including myself and Judah) took the Evaluator course a couple of weeks ago. It's obviously very early in my officiating career to do this, but it gives me the chance to learn the ropes in that area and help out where I can, and I also found it invaluable training that will help me to develop as a referee as well.

Robert Burns
08-03-06, 23:03
Ok,

Fixed the post bit thingy! (bit on the left with avatars).

Now onto other things.

Do we want the Arcade back, did anyone use it after the novelty wore off?

Mike Whittaker
09-03-06, 09:03
Ok,

Fixed the post bit thingy! (bit on the left with avatars).

Now onto other things.

Do we want the Arcade back, did anyone use it after the novelty wore off?

To be very honest, I never even looked at it, but then we old farts don't go in for that sort of thing, too busy out discoing!

Deeps
09-03-06, 09:03
I agree with Mike, not my scene.

Bryan
09-03-06, 10:03
I got my avatar back, so anything after that is a bonus. We procrastinate enough on the forums, so the last thing I want is an ongoing battle with Nick/Simon(s)/etc to see who's the best SlamDunk champion.

-Bryan

Simon Thomas
09-03-06, 11:03
I am all arcaded-out. Let's concentrate on rugby !

willsie
10-03-06, 22:03
i used them, allowed me to fill in time!! Lots of it too this year!!