[Line out] player joining lineout

[Dickie E]

Blue is awarded a lineout.

Blue set up lineout with 4 participating players, a receiver and another player in the tram tracks (I guess that is effectively 2 receivers).

Just before the throw is taken, the receiver steps into the lineout and the tram track player moves into the receiver position.

Is this a legal tactic?

 

[Taff]

Blue is awarded a lineout.
Blue set up lineout with 4 participating players, a receiver and another player in the tram tracks (I guess that is effectively 2 receivers).
Just before the throw is taken, the receiver steps into the lineout and the tram track player moves into the receiver position.
Is this a legal tactic?

For what it's worth, I would say yes.

If it's a Blue LO they shouldn't have a player in the "tramlines". The opposition do but Blue don't.

Participating players are allowed to swap places before the LO starts. And as it's a Blue LO, they set the maximum number of players.

It's messy, but my 2p reckons it's legal. The opposition should be able to spot something's up mind, because the Blue player in the tramlines has to go somewhere legal before the LO starts.

 

[didds]

hMMM... SO IN FACT BLUE THROW COULD HAVE TWO RECEIVERS (FORGET THE TRAM TARCKS) AS ONG AS ONE OF THEM ENTERS THE LINE OF JUMPERS/LIFTERS BEFORE THE THROW COMES IN?

DIDDS

 

[Taff]

hMMM... SO IN FACT BLUE THROW COULD HAVE TWO RECEIVERS (FORGET THE TRAM TARCKS) AS ONG AS ONE OF THEM ENTERS THE LINE OF JUMPERS/LIFTERS BEFORE THE THROW COMES IN?

But what are they going to gain? :chin:

The opposition know that at least one of the players in the "receivers" position will either have to join the LO or retreat to the 10m offside line before the LO starts ie before the ball is thrown in.

 

[crossref]

I imagine it's just to create confusion, uncertainty and distraction amongst the opposition, who are trying to match numbers.

I bet that the moment Red react, with a hasty addition / withdrawal of a man to match .. that will be the moment blue throw the ball in ..

 

[ChrisR]

The problem is Blue now have five in the LO to the ops four. The usual practice is to start with four in then drop one to receiver as the receiver steps in. Keeps the numbers at four.

I think it's unclear in law but would be a manage it for me.

 

[Dickie E]

I think it's unclear in law but would be a manage it for me.

when you say 'manage it' ... what exactly would you do?

 

[didds]

But what are they going to gain? :chin:

The opposition know that at least one of the players in the "receivers" position will either have to join the LO or retreat to the 10m offside line before the LO starts ie before the ball is thrown in.

well, ditto the attackjing LO bloke standing iun the tramlines?

What ythey don;t know whiuch none will enter which gap.

My point ins;t that I think its a great ides, just that if the tramline player is legal etc then so would a second receiver.

Or presumably three receivers with two of them entering a gap (thouh ISTR sdomething about entering to JUMP. But that may have been an "old" law).

didds

 

[ChrisR]

Regards the Law. This was in 2017 laws, not in 2018:

[LAWS](d) When the ball is in touch , every player who approaches the line of touch is presumed to do
so to form a lineout. Players who approach the line of touch must do so without delay.
Players of either team must not leave the lineout once they have taken up a position in the
lineout until the lineout has ended.
Sanction: Free Kick on the 15-metre line
[/LAWS]

Looks like some coach read the 2018 and caught on to the difference.

 

[ChrisR]

when you say 'manage it' ... what exactly would you do?

Before the throw:
"Blue, the man in the tramlines has to join as a lineout player or retire to the 10m. He can switch places with your receiver from the lineout. Red, you can add a player to the lineout if he joins."

After the fact? Do over with above.

 

[crossref]

Also in the 2017 Laws , but missing from 2018 is the requirement to give the oppo time to adjust to numbers

I think it is pretty clear that the tactics in the OP are perfectly ok .. and you don't penalise the oppo for numbers if they end up with one too manyn

 

[didds]

though if blue are throwig in th eexample its unlikely red will end up with one too many surely?

didds

 

[ChrisR]

I think that it is understood by all that at a lineout players can take up three distinct positions:

Thrower (or opposite number)

Receiver (one or none)

Line-out player.

The player in the throwing teams tramlines is none of these. Therefore he must be a non-participating player in an off-side position.

 

[crossref]

though if blue are throwig in th eexample its unlikely red will end up with one too many surely?

didds

Yes, but if the tramlines player at the last minute retreats 10m .. then they likely will

 

[ChrisR]

Life would be a little simpler for players, and maybe for refs, if teams only had to match 'participating players' and let 'em do it any way they want.

 

[Phil E]

when you say 'manage it' ... what exactly would you do?

Assuming Blue throw in.

Peep...what are you doing there? (to extra man in the trams).
Either join the lineout (in which case opposition have time to match numbers) or retire, but you can't stand there.

Or in the UK (because I know you guys down under don't announce numbers). Peep...Is this a four man or a five man lineout. Make you mind up please?

 

[Pinky]

Phil E and ChrisR have pointed out that the OP set-up is not legal as there should not be a blue player in the trams closer than 10m. Yes he coul dmove over to be come the receiver, but only if the other receiver has joined the line or retired 10m so I would expect all of that to happen and for the opposition to be given time to match before the throw in.

 

[Camquin]

If the throwing side have a man in the tram lines it is a potential free kick against under 18.10.
Participating players have to be between the 5 and 15 metres line.

Now unless they have already been messing about, it is probably a quick word and get them to move to the correct position and let the non-throwing sode match numbers. If I have had to speak to them, they lose the right to throw until I am ready.