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Thread: Ball carrier collapsing maul

      
  1. #11

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe@trfc View Post
    Blue takes the ball into contact and is kept up and a maul created, .......... This usually results in the ball carrier hanging on to the ball with legs trailing. If he's knee touches the ground .........
    A situation I see quite often is is the ball carrier trying to get to ground, but being held up by opposition players holding on to him and/or the ball. Ball carrier clearly would not be able to support his own weight, but not a part of him, apart from he backs of his heels that are being dragged across the pitch by the players holding him up in conjunction with ball carrier team driving forward, are on the ground.

    Is ball carrier off his feet?

    If so, should the call be for him to release the ball upon threat of penalty, or scrum to opposing side for unsuccessful end to a maul?

  2. #12

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    Quote Originally Posted by Wedgie View Post
    A situation I see quite often is is the ball carrier trying to get to ground, but being held up by opposition players holding on to him and/or the ball. Ball carrier clearly would not be able to support his own weight, but not a part of him, apart from he backs of his heels that are being dragged across the pitch by the players holding him up in conjunction with ball carrier team driving forward, are on the ground.

    Is ball carrier off his feet?

    If so, should the call be for him to release the ball upon threat of penalty, or scrum to opposing side for unsuccessful end to a maul?
    my view
    - if this is beginning to look dangerous then blow up, and unsuccessful maul, turnover
    - otherwise, if the maul is still moving, play on and see what happens

  3. #13
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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    Quote Originally Posted by Wedgie View Post
    A situation I see quite often is is the ball carrier trying to get to ground, but being held up by opposition players holding on to him and/or the ball. Ball carrier clearly would not be able to support his own weight, but not a part of him, apart from he backs of his heels that are being dragged across the pitch by the players holding him up in conjunction with ball carrier team driving forward, are on the ground.

    Is ball carrier off his feet?
    I'm assuming his heels are part of his feet, so no it doesnt sound like he is OFF them.

  4. #14
    Player or Coach ChrisR's Avatar

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    If the ball carrier is trying to get to ground and is just being dragged along then that indicates he is bound up, and probably the ball with him.

    These scenarios rarely resolve themselves quickly or cleanly and can end badly. This is one of those cases where I'd advocate a quick whistle and scrum. In most situations I'd recommend letting things play out but, from my experience, this isn't one of them.

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    Quote Originally Posted by Marauder View Post
    If the ball carrier is trying to get to ground and is just being dragged along then that indicates he is bound up, and probably the ball with him.

    These scenarios rarely resolve themselves quickly or cleanly and can end badly. This is one of those cases where I'd advocate a quick whistle and scrum. In most situations I'd recommend letting things play out but, from my experience, this isn't one of them.
    I wouldn't whistle quickly, reasons are
    * the maul must be moving significantly in order for him to be dragged
    * going to ground is permitted,
    * preventing the opposition from going to ground is also permitted
    * if he does g2g and is made to let go of the ball , then the opponents may develop this maul if they can, that's their perogative

    Once it stops moving, reassess.

    This approach is within law and rarely causes injury beyond that of normal play in my matches.

  6. #16

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    Quote Originally Posted by Wedgie View Post
    Is ball carrier off his feet?

    If so, should the call be for him to release the ball upon threat of penalty, or scrum to opposing side for unsuccessful end to a maul?
    Have you decided the game was in the "maul" phase?

    If so, why would the ball carried have to release the ball? There's no requirement for the ball carrier in a maul to release - and certainly no penalty.

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    Quote Originally Posted by Wedgie View Post
    A situation I see quite often is is the ball carrier trying to get to ground, but being held up by opposition players holding on to him and/or the ball. Ball carrier clearly would not be able to support his own weight, but not a part of him, apart from he backs of his heels that are being dragged across the pitch by the players holding him up in conjunction with ball carrier team driving forward, are on the ground.

    Is ball carrier off his feet?

    If so, should the call be for him to release the ball upon threat of penalty, or scrum to opposing side for unsuccessful end to a maul?
    OK - Thanks for the advice so far.

    We let the play develop - the maul continues, but the the BC gets to ground by such that he is sitting on the floor or laid on his back. The ball is still above him and he is wrestling to get the ball to the ground, but the ball is being counter-wrestled by opposition within the maul who are still on their feet.

    Should the call be for the ball carrier to release the ball upon threat of penalty, or scrum to opposing side for unsuccessful end to a maul?

  8. #18

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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    BC has gone to ground and ball is not immediately available. Unsuccessful end to maul. Scrum to opposition.
    When you are dead, you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others.
    It's the same when you are stupid.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    17.2(d) requires the BC to make the ball available immediately. When he can't because the ops are holding it up then the question is whether the sanction (PK) applies to this or does it apply to others in the maul should they not stay on their feet?

    Personally, I think a scrum for an unsuccessful end is appropriate.

  10. #20
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    Default Re: Ball carrier collapsing maul

    17.2(d) requires the BC to make the ball available immediately. When he can't because the ops are holding it up then the question is whether the sanction (PK) applies to this or does it apply to others in the maul should they not stay on their feet?

    Personally, I think a scrum for an unsuccessful end is appropriate.

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