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Thread: Player on ground plays the ball

      
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    Default Player on ground plays the ball

    Leicester thought they had scored a try in the first minute yesterday, but it was cancelled because a replay showed that after the ball came out of a tackle/ruck thingy, a Leicester player on the ground flipped the ball up to a team mate. The officials agreed he had "played the ball on the ground", and Saracens were awarded a penalty instead.

    The point has been argued previously, under various scenarios, but in this case, no further criteria were considered, and it was open play.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Didn't see the game but from the description, sounds like a correct decision.
    When you are dead, you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others.
    It's the same when you are stupid.

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    In open play it depends on HOW he got to ground. If it was a tackle, he can't play it, any other way...he can play it.

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackberry View Post
    In open play it depends on HOW he got to ground. If it was a tackle, he can't play it, any other way...he can play it.
    That was the whole point of previous discussions. My point was that the officials did not bring in any such criteria.

    It is of course possible that they thought it unnecessary to state that he was brought to ground in a tackle (was he? or was he just part of a collapsed ruck?). Or they may be of the opinion that he cannot play the ball when on the ground unless a law specifically allows it (eg 14 or 15).
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackberry View Post
    In open play it depends on HOW he got to ground. If it was a tackle, he can't play it, any other way...he can play it.
    If he is the ball carrier brought to ground in a tackle, he can play it by flipping it up to a team-mate provided he does so immediately. Once he releases it he cannot grab it again and do so.

    If he goes to ground to gather a loose ball, he can flip the ball up to a team mate. (Law 14)

    Any other circumstance where the is already on the ground and grabs the ball, e.g. he his on the ground from a previous tackle, and the ball is dislodged in a second tackle and rolls up to him, if he grabs or kicks the ball without first getting to his feet, he is playing the ball off his feet... PK
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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_Cook View Post
    Any other circumstance where the is already on the ground and grabs the ball, e.g. he his on the ground from a previous tackle, and the ball is dislodged in a second tackle and rolls up to him, if he grabs or kicks the ball without first getting to his feet, he is playing the ball off his feet... PK
    What's the law for that? I had this discussion offline with refs here, and this was the initial feeling - but when we looked at the law, we couldn't find support for it. So we concluded it was OK.

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_NL View Post
    What's the law for that? I had this discussion offline with refs here, and this was the initial feeling - but when we looked at the law, we couldn't find support for it. So we concluded it was OK.
    It isn't in the Law

    we have discussed this many times
    - one school of thought is Ian's, a player who happens to be on ground must get up before he can play the ball (the game is to be played by players on their feet)

    - the other school of thought is that the player on the ground who is lucky enough for the ball to happen to head his way is allowed precisely the same freedoms as a player who went to ground (to get up with it or pass it)

    I prefer the second, but the decision in the Semi-Final seems to bolster the first interpretation

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    It isn't in the Law

    we have discussed this many times
    - one school of thought is Ian's, a player who happens to be on ground must get up before he can play the ball (the game is to be played by players on their feet)

    - the other school of thought is that the player on the ground who is lucky enough for the ball to happen to head his way is allowed precisely the same freedoms as a player who went to ground (to get up with it or pass it)

    I prefer the second, but the decision in the Semi-Final seems to bolster the first interpretation
    I had a situation a couple of years ago where a player crawled (as quickly as it's possible to crawl) to a ball and played it. I'm not sure I'd consider that to be lucky.

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    It isn't in the Law

    - the other school of thought is that the player on the ground who is lucky enough for the ball to happen to head his way is allowed precisely the same freedoms as a player who went to ground (to get up with it or pass it)
    So would you also be happy for a player on the floor to tackle a ball carrier without getting to his feet first?

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    Default Re: Player on ground plays the ball

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil E View Post
    So would you also be happy for a player on the floor to tackle a ball carrier without getting to his feet first?
    no because
    14.1 Players on the ground
    A player on the ground must not tackle or attempt to tackle an opponent.


    but if a player is on the ground and the ball happily arrives ....

    If it's after a tackle he can't touch it

    15.6 Other players
    After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body is supported by the ground or players on the ground.


    but otherwise looks like he can ..

    14.1 Players on the ground
    (a)
    A player with the ball must immediately do one of three things:
    Get up with the ball
    Pass the ball
    Release the ball.



    but obviously we have discussed this before and there are two schools of thought. I wasn't really having another go to convince anyone, but Ian's answer made it seem like it was a settled consensus, and I don't think it is.
    Last edited by crossref; 26-05-16 at 11:05.

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