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Thread: Primary duties

      
  1. #11
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    Default Re: Primary duties

    On another point: Safety trumps everything and if there is a potential flash. That would take priority oven if I was act in a a TJ rather than being appointed to AR.

    No one ever got hurt from touch being missed. I'm with ChrisR (Post 6) It was the fault of the person commiting the foul play that touch mat have been missed by the AR. "Tell you what Blue 15, Explain to your coach why I had to watch you instead of the ball while you take a break in the bin!"

  2. #12

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Christy it was AIL Level, and yes you are correct that we are technically TJs. That said on occasion we can be miked up to the ref and the better ones arenít afraid to ask/take our advice.

    I suppose itís damned if you do and damned if you donít . If I follow the ball , I miss foul play less than 3m from me, if I follow the foul play I miss the ball in/out touch.

    There was no evidence that it did actually go out of play, there was an assessor there that never mentioned the incident at all after the match and the red players said it didnít go out (even after the game).

  3. #13

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Shelflife View Post
    Christy it was AIL Level, and yes you are correct that we are technically TJs
    It's important to know the difference. In RFU land....
    A TJ cannot flag foul play, they are there to mark touch and kicks at goal, that's as far as their responsibilities go.
    An AR (who will have done a Society AR course or equivalent) has the power to flag Foul play and anything else the referee asks of him.

    If a TJ was to flag foul play and it resulted in a card, the TJ would have to write the report....at which point it would be thrown out as he does no the have the authority to do so.

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  4. #14
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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil E View Post
    It's important to know the difference. In RFU land....
    A TJ cannot flag foul play, they are there to mark touch and kicks at goal, that's as far as their responsibilities go.
    An AR (who will have done a Society AR course or equivalent) has the power to flag Foul play and anything else the referee asks of him.

    If a TJ was to flag foul play and it resulted in a card, the TJ would have to write the report....at which point it would be thrown out as he does no the have the authority to do so.


    Thatís interesting, Phil. I was on the RFU TJ panel right at its inception in 1990, long before the term AR had been invented, and before radio comms twixt ref and TJs existed. My very first match, on the first day of the system, was up at Sarries v Moseley in Southgate. We had no official kit nor even flags! Sarries had to scamper around to find flags for us! Our ref for that match was no less than Roger Q.
    The purpose of our existence was to indicate foul play, as well as touch. Roger accepted my report of a stamp within 10 min or so, and awarded a penalty accordingly.
    Nearly all refs in those days accepted our assistance willingly, though there was a famous one from Liverpool, who I was told preferred to do things his way.

  5. #15

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Phil E we have flagging powers.

    In the event of an injury to the ref we would replace them.
    Courage is knowing what lies on the other side and still opening the door !

  6. #16

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Shelflife View Post
    Phil E we have flagging powers.
    Powers diminish as game progresses?
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  7. #17

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil E View Post
    It's important to know the difference. In RFU land....
    A TJ cannot flag foul play, they are there to mark touch and kicks at goal, that's as far as their responsibilities go.
    An AR (who will have done a Society AR course or equivalent) has the power to flag Foul play and anything else the referee asks of him.

    If a TJ was to flag foul play and it resulted in a card, the TJ would have to write the report....at which point it would be thrown out as he does no the have the authority to do so.
    and, as I understand it in RFU land, the AR has to be appointed to the game. So if Wayne Barnes was strolling past and offered to run touch, he would be a TJ, not an AR.
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  8. #18

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Shelflife View Post
    Christy it was AIL Level, and yes you are correct that we are technically TJs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shelflife View Post
    Phil E we have flagging powers. In the event of an injury to the ref we would replace them.
    If by "flagging powers" you mean you can signal Foul Play, and you have presumably been appointed to that game, that makes you a de facto AR, doesn't it?
    Last edited by Taff; 15-10-17 at 23:10.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil E View Post
    It's important to know the difference. In RFU land....
    A TJ cannot flag foul play, they are there to mark touch and kicks at goal, that's as far as their responsibilities go.
    An AR (who will have done a Society AR course or equivalent) has the power to flag Foul play and anything else the referee asks of him.

    If a TJ was to flag foul play and it resulted in a card, the TJ would have to write the report....at which point it would be thrown out as he does no the have the authority to do so.
    Yes a rule of the RFU but not in Wales or, from Shelflife's later post, the IRFU either. I take Taff's point that if you give TJs power to act as more than a TJ you are effectively making them ARs. So bst call them that.

    WR differentiates between the two and whilst the IRFU can give any flag bearer the powers of an AR , if they call tham TJs they are muddying the waters.

  10. #20

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    Default Re: Primary duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Taff View Post
    If by "flagging powers" you mean you can signal Foul Play, and you have presumably been appointed to that game, that makes you a de facto AR, doesn't it?
    In effect yes , but even though we are appointed and have flagging powers we are still officially refereed to as TJs.

    Not it sure what the logic behind it is .
    Courage is knowing what lies on the other side and still opening the door !

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