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Thread: Ireland v France - HIA issue

      
  1. #11

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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    So perhaps some one on the potch really did, genuinely, think they saw a blow to the head ?
    In which case any doctor hearing that would likely say HIA just to be safe

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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    The only problem I have with that idea crossref, is that twice in this game, players with knee injuries were taken off for HIA. Given the scant regard begrudgingly given to player safety in Elite circle already; the protocol should not be misused as a tactical tool. Suggestions that the Independent medical doctor was erring on the side of caution, are not so convincing, when you see players, like Sexton being returned to the fray after being unconscious on the field of play. I know, one can be knocked to the head without getting a concussion. Only the HIA protocol does work that way, suspected concussion is what it deals with.
    Also it is not the first time France have misused HIA to get a prefered player back on the pitch, during the dying minutes of the game.
    Last year, the French Rugby Federation was reprimanded over the controversial substitution of prop Uini Atonio during their win over Wales in Paris. A review group found France had not complied with HIA protocol and/or the relevant laws of the game after Atonio was replaced during the dying stages, with preferred tighthead Rabah Slimani coming back on.
    Coincidence? Maybe, but sure is starting to look like an abusif use of the player safety protocols. And yes, Interchanges will resolve the tactical aspect, however the underlying problem is not going away.
    Last edited by L'irlandais; 05-02-18 at 09:02.
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  3. #13
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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    So perhaps some one on the potch really did, genuinely, think they saw a blow to the head ?
    In which case any doctor hearing that would likely say HIA just to be safe
    Indeed but it would stop the comments typical of the post I was replying to. A player says his head hurts and the Doc, independent or not, cannot argue he must investigate it. T oignore leaves the door wide open. This applies whoever the doc is and whatever way he was apointed. But at least the cnyde carping is put to bed if the guy is clearly independent.

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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    So perhaps some one on the potch really did, genuinely, think they saw a blow to the head ?
    In which case any doctor hearing that would likely say HIA just to be safe
    Except you don't need a blow to the head to get concussion. So the player's reactions may suggest the possibility. Better safe than sorry.

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    Arrow Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Both players clearly injured their knees. The suspected head injury was a red herring.
    Medical examinations, held on Sunday, confirmed the coaching staff's fears for the French players injured against Ireland. Matthieu Jalibert suffers from a partial rupture of the posterior ligament of the left knee. For Antoine Dupont, it is even more serious, he suffers from a rupture of the cruciate ligaments and his season is over.
    Source : MidOl

    It does make one wonder about patient care; when both players were allowed hobble of the field of play, with torn knee ligaments. It’s not like they are playing grass roots rugby where they don’t have the necessary equipment to minimize further damage. stretcher, golfcart, ? A review of medical care in Elite rugby is long overdue.
    Last edited by L'irlandais; 05-02-18 at 10:02.
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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    It may be. I trust you'll have no such red herrigs where a death occurs soon after. Perhaps the system that footbal tried a while ago would be possible. ANY player that recieves medical treatment MUST leave the field and cannpt return until the next stoppage. During that time the doctor can refer it to a HIA. and only then can the player be replaced.

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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Wakeham View Post
    It may be. I trust you'll have no such red herrigs where a death occurs soon after. Perhaps the system that footbal tried a while ago would be possible. ANY player that recieves medical treatment MUST leave the field and cannpt return until the next stoppage. During that time the doctor can refer it to a HIA. and only then can the player be replaced.
    The danger of this, and indeed of interchanges, is that a genuinely injured (concussed) player may continue because he doesn't want to let his side down, or the max number of interchanges has been reached. Unless you're going to allow as many interchanges as a team wants...

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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Personally I find it hard to believe somebody was erring on the side of caution, when you see how serious injury is dealt with in Elite rugby these days. Players are viewed as expendable. Professional rugby is plagued by ligament injuries at the moment, yet no plan exists to improve player safety in this respect.
    Josh van der Flier has been ruled out of the remainder of Ireland’s Six Nations Championship after suffering a knee injury in the win over France. The flanker hobbled off before half time at the Stade de France and the worst fears were confirmed today - his season is over due to a "serious knee ligament injury".
    Source RTE
    Last edited by L'irlandais; 05-02-18 at 14:02.
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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Quote Originally Posted by L'irlandais View Post
    Personally I find it hard to believe somebody was erring on the side of caution, when you see how serious injury is dealt with in Elite rugby these days. Players are viewed as expendable. Professional rugby is plagued by ligament injuries at the moment, yet no plan exists to improve player safety in this respect.
    Josh van der Flier has been ruled out of the remainder of Ireland’s Six Nations Championship after suffering a knee injury in the win over France. The flanker hobbled off before half time at the Stade de France and the worst fears were confirmed today - his season is over due to a "serious knee ligament injury".
    Source RTE
    With all due respect, A concussion carries far more worrying possible consequences than ligament / tendon or even bone injuries. Sport the world over is waking up to the issue. Rugby cannot ignore. Yes we need to watch for abuse, and come down hard on it. After all abuse of such an important matter needs t obe views seriously.

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    Default Re: Ireland v France - HIA issue

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Wakeham View Post
    With all due respect, A concussion carries far more worrying possible consequences than ligament / tendon or even bone injuries. Sport the world over is waking up to the issue. Rugby cannot ignore. Yes we need to watch for abuse, and come down hard on it. After all abuse of such an important matter needs t obe views seriously.
    You've clearly never suffered a significant ligament injury. I've had a concussion and a ligament injury and I can assure you the ligament I just has had much more lasting consequences than the concussion.

    I get the point you are trying to make, but be wary of such generalisations as they are not helpful to the arguments.

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