Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 21

Thread: Podcast!

      
  1. #11

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    --
    Grade
    Grassroots
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    17,778
    Thanks (Received)
    139
    Likes (Received)
    1765

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisR View Post
    No, I said 10 a side. Point being that players get more touches on the ball with less players and still plenty of contact.
    you would need more teams, more refs, more coaches, more pitch space -- We had 40ish players in our u16.. Running a A and B team they all got game time.. not sure we had the resurces to divide them into A B and C (and the C team, with the ten worst players would have been pretty difficult to manage, and develop players in)


    But look we all agree on the principle
    - youngsters play on small pitches with much <15 a side
    - adults play on full size pitches with 15
    - there's a gradual transition

    I'd say by u16 they are playing the adult game, you place it older.
    Last edited by crossref; 21-03-18 at 21:03.

  2. #12

    Resident Club Coach
    didds's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    N/A
    Grade
    Club Coach
    Join Date
    27 Jan 04
    Posts
    9,705
    Thanks (Received)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    933

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Quote Originally Posted by Camquin View Post
    ChrisR

    In England Boys play 15 a side full pitch at u14, 13 a side 90x60m at u13, 10 a side half pitch at u12.
    I am sure our Antipodean cousins will say that is too much cotton wool.

    Girls play 10 a side at u13, 13 a side until 15 and 15 a side thereafter - if they have the numbers.

    So not quite as restricted as you suggest.

    I tend to agree that there is little to be gained playing on a full pitch and everyone else watching the winger repeatedly sprint 40m to the line,
    I can recall a watching an early sdeason 13 a side match on a full size pitch a few years ago.

    At a lineout the wingers were in line with the goal post on the lineout side...

    didds
    Last edited by didds; 21-03-18 at 23:03.

  3. #13

    Resident Club Coach
    didds's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    N/A
    Grade
    Club Coach
    Join Date
    27 Jan 04
    Posts
    9,705
    Thanks (Received)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    933

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisR View Post
    No, I said 10 a side. Point being that players get more touches on the ball with less players and still plenty of contact.
    I get what ChrisR is saying, and even agree with some of it.

    The one thing that doesn;t quite gel with me is that at U12 there ate 2 x 12 (6 forwards, 6 backs) a side on a half sized pitch, played across the pitch" and there is just no space for anybody to do anything. I'm not sure dropping a blind side wing and a back row forward really increases that.



    this isn't to knock Chris's idea at all becaue I think it has lots of merit, but i would say its needs a little more than that ha;f a pitch. And now you run into space issues and dedicated U13/U14 sized pitches (say) that struggle to be used by anybody else.

    So you end up with U13s on a pitch that is WAY to huge for them, or they end up playing all but 7s on half a pitch (cos 12 a side is too "busy") with maybe 9 a side. Its a tough call.

    I can think of a sort of compromise - but its probably complicating factors too much (smaller marked pitch in eg red lines situated within the full size one, with all conversions taken in front of the nearest posts, no 3 point PKs. Its just more work for the groundsman.)

    didds

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    and the C team, with the ten worst players
    why would the C team HAVE to have the ten worst players?

    didds

  4. #14

    Resident Club Coach
    didds's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    N/A
    Grade
    Club Coach
    Join Date
    27 Jan 04
    Posts
    9,705
    Thanks (Received)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    933

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    I'd say by u16 they are playing the adult game, you place it older.
    Yup, agree. In effect the only difference is

    * scrum push limited to 1.5m
    * no squeezeball

    U16s can handle a full sized pitch easily. and our U14s can to be honest. our U14 #10 can restart drop kick deep into the oppo 22m - that's unusual for this age group admittedly, but space usage isn;t much different from what I expect senior players to use.

    didds

    didds

  5. #15
    Player or Coach ChrisR's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    None
    Grade
    Select Grade
    Join Date
    14 Jul 10
    Posts
    3,227
    Thanks (Received)
    33
    Likes (Received)
    320

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    you would need more teams, more refs, more coaches, more pitch space -- We had 40ish players in our u16.. Running a A and B team they all got game time.. not sure we had the resurces to divide them into A B and C (and the C team, with the ten worst players would have been pretty difficult to manage, and develop players in)
    Field space, and lining the pitches, is the only real difficulty.

    When you start working with smaller groups you will find that more people get involved.
    Shorter games with fewer players on small pitches means that old guys like me can still be effective refs.

    Working out the logistics is just that: Working out the logistics.

    The net result is more touches per player per game and that's the big plus. Having the Cs play Cs also gets players actively involved in the game that would otherwise just follow the mob.

    The resistance to this? Tradition and coaches and parents egos. I've heard it all before as "It's not real rugby" or, in my case "It's not real soccer". The latter when I took over my kids soccer club, abolished 11-a-side for 6 yrs old and instituted 4-a-side with tiny goals on tiny fields with no rules.

    Agree that at 16 kids could, and probably should, be playing 15s on a full pitch. However, their skill development occurs (or should) well before then and that's the value of small sided.

  6. #16

    Resident Club Coach
    didds's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    N/A
    Grade
    Club Coach
    Join Date
    27 Jan 04
    Posts
    9,705
    Thanks (Received)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    933

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Amen Chris. Despite my caveats earlier I do wholeheartedly concur.

    didds

  7. #17

    Resident Club Coach
    didds's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    N/A
    Grade
    Club Coach
    Join Date
    27 Jan 04
    Posts
    9,705
    Thanks (Received)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    933

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Current RFU regs for U13s include

    Team numbers: a maximum of 13-a-side
    Maximum pitch size: 90 metres x 60 metres

    I'd wager quite a few U13s teams play on (slightly) bigger pitches then that, if only because their seniors play on pitches that are 100m x 70m.

    WRT to smaller pitches and groundsmen... It can;t be THAT difficult with the aid of some suitably bright cones to define the playing pitch as being bounded by the 5m and 15m lines (or if that's too small the 5m and 5m lines and a suitable in goal area marked with cones within that. All conversions taken either in front of existing posts wherever the kicker feels confortable, defenders behindf the "full" goalline. Or, as normal even with defenders behind the "full goalline" ignoring the exiustence of the "short" goaline if realy necessary (I can;t think when it might be).

    didds

  8. #18

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    --
    Grade
    Grassroots
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    17,778
    Thanks (Received)
    139
    Likes (Received)
    1765

    Default Re: Podcast!

    We have small pitches and reduced numbers for young kids (and good thing too) . I am sure we all agree with that.

    I think we all agree also that u16 should be playing 15 a side on full size pitches , as indeed is the case in every country I think

  9. #19

    Referees in Australia
    menace's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    ACTRRA
    Grade
    Level 2
    Join Date
    20 Nov 09
    Posts
    3,551
    Thanks (Received)
    60
    Likes (Received)
    489
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Quote Originally Posted by Camquin View Post
    ChrisR

    In England Boys play 15 a side full pitch at u14, 13 a side 90x60m at u13, 10 a side half pitch at u12.
    I am sure our Antipodean cousins will say that is too much cotton wool.

    Girls play 10 a side at u13, 13 a side until 15 and 15 a side thereafter - if they have the numbers.

    So not quite as restricted as you suggest.

    I tend to agree that there is little to be gained playing on a full pitch and everyone else watching the winger repeatedly sprint 40m to the line,
    Nah..the cotton wool is all used up on thr lineout jumpers!!

    I actually like that....it would help here to put more teams in the comps and if all laws stay put then its still rugby and a good stepping to 15s.
    Our 12s is 12 per side...i think that should extend to 13s and maybe even 14s.
    Last edited by menace; 22-03-18 at 22:03.
    Tell em it's Law 23 and smile

  10. #20

    Referees in Scotland
    Jolly Roger's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Edinburgh - ERRS
    Grade
    Level 6
    Join Date
    19 Feb 10
    Posts
    181
    Thanks (Received)
    5
    Likes (Received)
    52

    Default Re: Podcast!

    Really interesting discussion, Didds. Thanks for posting, and I agree with all that you said on the pod.

    Having been involved in youth rugby from U9-U18 as a coach and referee over the past 8 years, in addition to adult refereeing, I would add that scrummaging is an integral part of the game of Rugby Union and that many young players identify with a particular scum position and want to scrummage. That is not necessarily the same requirement as coaching the scrum in a competitive manner. However, as we now have leagues in Scotland from U14 upwards, the competitiveness of the scrum increases accordingly as we go up through the age groups. That is not to say that there is no room to introduce players to new positions; this is just a coaching requirement, as you so clearly explained.

    My personal view is that scrummaging is important part of the sport from U12 onwards as a means of developing game shape and enabling youngsters to identify with the game of rugby. It then starts to become slightly technical from U14 and increases year on year until we reach U18 when some technical cometence is necessary to compete safely. I think that the national bodies seem to have it about right now.
    Keep smiling!

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •