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Thread: Pulling a player at the Ruck

      
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    Default Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Hi All
    The scenario is, ball carrier is tackled, both go to ground, attacking player arrives and rucks over the ball, a defending player arrives and grabs the player over the ball, pulling towards him to destabilise and then picks the ball up.

    Is the defending player

    a - Bound onto the ruck by the action of grabbing the shirt?
    b - Offside as soon as he releases the shirt unless he were to exit the ruck and reenter through the gate?
    C- Is the defending player allowed to pull a player towards him?
    I understood you could only drive the player back over the ball or ruck the ball back with your foot (as long as it was safe to do so)

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    Player or Coach ChrisR's Avatar

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Welcome to the Forum, Winco, and a good question.

    Under 2017 laws pulling a player forward from a ruck was not expressly forbidden but could be penalized for collapsing the ruck if he went to ground.

    Now, 2018 Law has added:

    15.10. Possession may be won either by rucking or by pushing the opposing team off the ball.


    Therefore, pulling an opponent off the ball is forbidden (I assume).

    (crossref, another change?)

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Hi wing .
    Red 7 tackled & places ball on floor for his arriving team mate .
    Red 5 comes to tackle area , steps over ball & probably latches onto his own team mate.
    We now have a 1 man ruck

    Blue 5 comes to ruck , grabs red 5 & pulls him down towards him self .

    I would see if red team mates can win ball 1st of all .
    If they cant , i wouldnt allow blue 5 to simply pick up ball.

    Penalty for collapsing ruck .against blue 5 .

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Collapsing ruck, Christy?.... other than someone stupidly jumping on any players who might have held their feet.

    Can't say I've ever seen it penalised.
    Last edited by ChuckieB; 26-03-18 at 22:03.

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    Player or Coach ChrisR's Avatar

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    . . . . and if the player (the one being pulled) stays on his feet?

    I think the 2018 change puts an end to pulling but I wish they'd specifically outlawed it. I don't like law by omission or insinuation.

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisR View Post
    . . . . and if the player (the one being pulled) stays on his feet?

    I think the 2018 change puts an end to pulling but I wish they'd specifically outlawed it. I don't like law by omission or insinuation.
    I agree we cant induce that pulling is outlawed!!. The basic application of our laws is that everything is permitted unless it specifically says that an action is forbidden. For obvious reasons they cannot possibly list all the things you can do!
    Tell em it's Law 23 and smile

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckieB View Post
    Collapsing ruck, Christy?.... other than someone stupidly jumping on any players who might have held their feet.

    Can't say I've ever seen it penalised.
    I have never seen, nor have I ever, penalised anyone for collapsing a ruck.

    I asked a related question at a society meeting recently and it transpired that no body there had ever seen it and our advisor said not to start penalising it now either! !

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisR View Post
    . . . . and if the player (the one being pulled) stays on his feet?

    I think the 2018 change puts an end to pulling but I wish they'd specifically outlawed it. I don't like law by omission or insinuation.
    I hardly think it is possible to consider pulling as being at an end. Too much murky water remains around the whole issue of clearouts
    Last edited by ChuckieB; 27-03-18 at 00:03.

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckieB View Post
    I hardly think it is possible to consider pulling as being at an end. Too much murky water remains around the whole issue of clearouts
    It's a shame they didn't address that in the rewrite, they could have removed the offence of collapsing a ruck, to bring the Law into line with commonly accepted practice .

    However it's interesting to note that they have moved in that direction ...

    2017
    (c) A player must not intentionally collapse a ruck. This is dangerous play.
    Sanction: Penalty kick


    2018
    Players must not:
    ...
    Intentionally collapse a ruck or jump on top of it.


    Note that the Law has been significantly softened , collapsing a ruck is no longer defined as being dangerous play .

    I'd say they are preparing the ground for removing the Law altogether .. perhaps next year.

    It is hard to make something legal that was previously described as dangerous.. so do it in steps
    Last edited by crossref; 27-03-18 at 07:03.

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    Rugby Club Member Rich_NL's Avatar

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    Default Re: Pulling a player at the Ruck

    I penalised diving on/collapsing the ruck this weekend - a front-rower decided that a running belly flop onto two defenders over the ball was a good way to clear things out. "What? But I bound!"

    I've seen several attempts to pull the player over the ruck, but yet to see it happen with a full arm bind.

    If you want to get very legalistic about it, then as menace says it's not forbidden - but possession can't be won that way.

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