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Thread: Are the french more forgiving?

      
  1. #11

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_Cook View Post
    IRFU/Ulster seem to have missed seeing the word I have highlighted. It means they are deemed by the court to be NOT guilty, i.e. to have NOT done the things they were accused of. This should mean that the state of affairs should be restored to how things were before they were accused, i.e. it never happened.
    I'm not sure I agree. "Not Guilty" means that the Prosecution couldn't make the case to the standard of beyond a reasonable doubt.

    It isn't a statement that the thing of which they were accused didn't happen.
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  2. #12

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Even if you 100% believed the two men, I don't think many people would want to employ them.
    They deserved to be fired because of what the admitted to,
    Last edited by crossref; 1 Week Ago at 14:06.

  3. #13

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    I think Northern Ireland is pretty conservative compared to any other region in the UK.
    I seem to remember some sponsors had made it clear to the club, it was «*them or us*»; so an element of the club’s sponsor not wishing to be associated with the behaviour of these players.

    France and the french have seen worse par exemple. The attitude here seems to be one of separation between private life and professional image. What one gets up to in the bedroom is no one else’s business. So the French are much more liberal than any region of the UK I have experienced’ in that respect. I don’t think it’s a question of forgiveness, rather one of «*don’t see what all the fuss is about, if they can play rugby, that’s what we want from them.*»

    Bear in mind French clubs hire and fire freely. If they don’t preform on the field of play they’ll be dropped fairly sharpish. And may still subsequently struggle to find a home country club that will over look the whole affair.
    Last edited by L'irlandais; 6 Days Ago at 20:06.
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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Are you familiar with the details of the case?

  5. #15

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Yes.
    However, I was answering the question asked in the thread title and attempting to keep my personal opinion of the trial to myself. After 18 years living and working in this country I was hoping to give some insight into the cultural differences.
    Perpignan’s decision to employ Paddy Jackson tells us more about their ambitions to return to Top flight rugby, than it tells us about what they think of his off-the-field shenanigans. Club’s website
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  6. #16

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    I think it tells us a number of things about the priorities,culture and values of the club and the people in charge of the club.

    And given you are familiar with the case your dismissal of what happened as "shenanigans" tells us a lot about your values
    Last edited by crossref; 6 Days Ago at 07:06.

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Quote Originally Posted by VM75 View Post
    It's a subject fraught with political & commercial prejudices, When Ched Evans [a not dissimilar footballer case] was eventually acquitted sponsors, gold medal athletes, amongst others all pulled influence over not employing him. Even acquitted associate Clayton McDonald struggled to get employment because of the linked association.
    Jessica Ennis requested her name be removed from a stand when Evans was released from prison have served his sentence. Not when he was found not guilty.
    He actually served the sentence (with parole) for a crime he was later found not guilty of. So the situation is a little different.

    There is an issue if:

    1: People can be found guilty by the press and the public. Two groups that do not have the full facts of the case. Indeed the public often rely of papers like the Scum and the Daily HEIL (Sorry Sun and Daily Mail) for the "facts" two of the mosti disgusting examples of "newspaper" in the UK.

    2: The basic principle of doing your time and being rehabilitated into society being prevented by "factory doors" being slammed in an ex-con's face. OF course there are jobs that must be closed to a recently released prisoner. In some cases; you'd not allow a child sex offender to work with children or a bank robber to work in a bank etc. BUT unless the person's job played a part in the crime (eg if a sportsman used their "fame" to acess women for the purpose of rape) I think the aim should be that we allow everyone to move on and rebuild there lives.

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Should these two be legally barred from getting a job? No
    Should clubs be legally barred from employing them ? No

    Would I have them into my rugby club ?
    No

    (And Don't you think these two used their status as rugby players?)

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    You failed to read my post correctly. I've offered no comment on the case. I am not in a position to as I don't have the facts.

    I am putting forward a general principle and correcting an error in an earlier post.

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    Default Re: Are the french more forgiving?

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    And given you are familiar with the case your dismissal of what happened as "shenanigans" tells us a lot about your values
    PEEP! Playing the man without the ball!

    FWIW I thought L'irlandais' (as someone who's lived in both countries) response was quite informative about the different cultures.

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