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Thread: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

      
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    Default Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    In a bid to increase "ball-in-play" time and reduce the frequency of scrums ( and the consequential number of reset-scrums, scrum-penalties ) there has been some discussion recently about an interesting law-change to allow accidental knock-ons.
    Fans of the "EggChasers podcast" will be familiar with this, and on first impression it sounds ridiculous.
    But upon further inspection, it could be something worth a trial.

    Deliberate knock-ons and throw-forwards are still penalised.
    An accidental knock-on, can still put a team-mate offside so, that would still be penalised. But the idea is that accidental offsides are rarely beneficial to the perpertrator. The ball is lost towards the opposition. If a player does manage to re-gather the ball after losing it then "play-on"!

    There were some other suggestion about penalising knock-ons only in your opponents 22 but I can see big problems with that particular idea.

    But in general, what are the pros/cons ?

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    I can see the argument but it "dumbs down" the game. I can see more of an argument to use "material effect" in the case of a knock on. So Red hoof the ball down field and Blue 15 knocks on and regathers with no red player within the "preverbial "country mile" of him. Why let red gains from a speculative kick producing a knock on that only disadvantaged the "offender"? I can see merit in that argument.

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    I think it's an intriguing idea (not a new one) that would be worth a trial to see what happens

    NB lots of age grade rugby is played this way in England under the RFU NROP

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    It is not so crazy. I remember watching a vintage highlight reel somewhere on this website, and was shocked at the number of accidental knock ons with play continuing.

    TBH the game need to be dumbed down. Laws have become to numerous and to specific. i.e. binding requirements at scrum and line outs lifting. It is a physical game; it is not a game of who read the law book and who did not.

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    worth a trial somewhere I reckon indeed.

    It would have to be really thought hard about though... eg scrumhalf at the base of a slow ruck stops to pick up just as the oppo counter-ruck/shove hard and cause him to knock on. It was accidental from the s/half perspective but by the same token was the result of pressure created by the oppo and/or rubbish play by his ruckers.

    Similar stuff could be a knock-on in the centre where a shovelled pass from #10 in the face of an onrushing defender causes pressure on the catcher etc.

    didds
    Last edited by didds; 29-01-19 at 14:01.

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    "But the idea is that accidental offsides are rarely beneficial to the perpetrator" - which is why we play advantage...

    I can understand increasing considerations of materiality, but can't see scrapping it as a good move, let alone jntroducing another level of subjective decision-making as to whether it was accidental or not. Even so, you're lowering the technical level of the game.

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    We already have to judge whether knock ons are deliberate or not, because deliberate ones are a PK (and would remain so )

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    Any sport's set of rules are fundamentally arbitrary; the choices about what will or won't be allowed give each sport its own unique character. Rugby has, for as long as anyone can remember, always considered a knock-on illegal - there's no law of nature that says it must be so, but it's part of what gives rugby its rugby-like character.

    Changing the status of the knock-on would be an unnecessary change to the game - this isn't a safety issue, it's just an arbitrary thing. If we go down this path, then why not other changes? Why don't we start limiting the number of tackles a team can keep the ball for? Perhaps we could reduce the number of players, allow forward passes, permit contact with non-ball carriers, give the players more padding, and go to unlimited rolling subs? Or maybe we outlaw handling the ball, make the ball rounder, hang a net off the back of the posts, and cut the uprights off at the crossbar? Make the ball really small and give the players sticks? Play on ice?

    Yes, these are arguments ad absurdam - but at what point would rugby stop being rugby?
    If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs and blaming it on you... you must be a rugby referee!

    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity - and I'm not sure about the universe..." - Albert Einstein

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    I'd like to see it trialled - a knock-on being its own disadvantage makes some sense.

    You'd have to guard against players paddling the ball along the ground in front of them under the guise of trying to pick it up.
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

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    Default Re: Law Change Proposal - Elminate accidental knock-ons

    It would be very odd for someone to knock on in the process of scoring, and be awarded a try

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