Page 8 of 10 FirstFirst ... 45678910 LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 93

Thread: NO on forward pasess

      
  1. #71

    Advises in England
    OB..'s Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Glos & District
    Grade
    Adviser (grass roots)
    Join Date
    07 Oct 04
    Posts
    22,305
    Thanks (Received)
    99
    Likes (Received)
    1416

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    I think
    1 you see that frequently
    2 its never called as forward
    3 if anyone ever called it forward people would think it crazy
    I have never seen a player throw the ball back over his shoulder when running towards his own DBL.

    Three scenarios - X is running towards his own DBL with the ball:
    1. X passes to Y who is several metres nearer the DBL.
    2. X passes sideways exactly compensating for his own backward speed.
    3. X throws the ball back over his shoulder.

    You appear to be claiming that all three are valid passes ie it does not matter how he passes as long as he is running towards his own DBL. That is tantamount to saying that it is impossible for him to throw a forward pass, which does not make sense.

    Please explain what you would accept as a throw forward from player X.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

  2. #72

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    LSRFUR
    Grade
    10
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    16,218
    Thanks (Received)
    122
    Likes (Received)
    1555

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by OB.. View Post
    I have never seen a player throw the ball back over his shoulder when running towards his own DBL.
    whoever mentioned that?
    using velocity vectors is NOT a good way to define a forward pass as no one understands it.

    Scenario
    - a player is running toward his own goal line, forward velocity -10
    - as he crosses the 22m line he passes the ball along the 22m line to a team mate.
    - forward velocity of the ball = 0 (it's travelling along the 22m line)
    - this is NOT a forward pass
    - even though he changed the forward velocity of the ball from -10 to 0

    OB.. please concentrate on the scenario as written

  3. #73

    Advises in England
    OB..'s Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Glos & District
    Grade
    Adviser (grass roots)
    Join Date
    07 Oct 04
    Posts
    22,305
    Thanks (Received)
    99
    Likes (Received)
    1416

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    whoever mentioned that?
    using velocity vectors is NOT a good way to define a forward pass as no one understands it.

    Scenario
    - a player is running toward his own goal line, forward velocity -10
    - as he crosses the 22m line he passes the ball along the 22m line to a team mate.
    - forward velocity of the ball = 0 (it's travelling along the 22m line)
    - this is NOT a forward pass
    - even though he changed the forward velocity of the ball from -10 to 0

    OB.. please concentrate on the scenario as written
    The point is that he INCREASED the forward speed from -10 to 0. That is a forward pass. We do not measure a pass by its speed over the ground, but by its direction relative to the passer.

    I gave you three examples which covered three different directions relative to the passer - forwards, sideways, and backwards. They cannot all three be valid passes.

    The requirement is that the ball should not be moving forward relative to the passer when it leaves the passer's hands. That is exactly equivalent to my statement that the passer must not increase the forward speed of the ball, but the latter is easier to measure if you have the equipment.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

  4. #74

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    Club
    Grade
    interested bystander
    Join Date
    02 May 07
    Posts
    4,576
    Thanks (Received)
    4
    Likes (Received)
    79

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    i understand what crossref is saying, but i'm almost scared to say that i agree with him...

    i reckon it's likely to come up in the games tomorrow. i'll try to remember to take a note of the time it does.
    Hi. I'm Barry Scott.

  5. #75

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    LSRFUR
    Grade
    10
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    16,218
    Thanks (Received)
    122
    Likes (Received)
    1555

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by OB.. View Post
    The point is that he INCREASED the forward speed from -10 to 0. That is a forward pass.
    t.
    Yes he did
    But no it isn't
    This happens all the time . No one ever gives a forward pass when the ball is travelling toward the passers own DBL (or in this case perfectly sideways)

    Your velocity definition doesn't give the right result .
    Last edited by crossref; 6 Days Ago at 19:03.

  6. #76
    Rugby Club Member

    Soc/Assoc
    Prefer not to say
    Grade
    Retired
    Join Date
    10 Dec 15
    Posts
    1,751
    Thanks (Received)
    17
    Likes (Received)
    392

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    - as he crosses the 22m line he passes the ball along the 22m line to a team mate.
    This would necessitate him throwing the ball forward.

    Were it a short pass you might get away with it, but the ball is always going to travel forward relative to the thrower.

  7. #77

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    LSRFUR
    Grade
    10
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    16,218
    Thanks (Received)
    122
    Likes (Received)
    1555

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by DocY View Post
    This would necessitate him throwing the ball forward.

    Were it a short pass you might get away with it, but the ball is always going to travel forward relative to the thrower.
    Indeed but it's not uncommon and no one ever calls itna forward pass, when it doesn't go forwards

  8. #78

    Advises in England
    OB..'s Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Glos & District
    Grade
    Adviser (grass roots)
    Join Date
    07 Oct 04
    Posts
    22,305
    Thanks (Received)
    99
    Likes (Received)
    1416

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    Indeed but it's not uncommon and no one ever calls itna forward pass, when it doesn't go forwards
    "Forwards" is judged relative to the player, not the ground. In this case you appear to be judging it relative to the ground. Is that your criterion?
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

  9. #79
    Rugby Club Member Treadmore's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Dorchester
    Grade
    Coach Colts/ELRA 1&2
    Join Date
    11 Nov 08
    Posts
    287
    Thanks (Received)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    24

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by OB.. View Post
    "Forwards" is judged relative to the player, not the ground. In this case you appear to be judging it relative to the ground. Is that your criterion?
    not sure why you're struggling with this OB, crossref has just reversed the usual momentum situation (and it is a foward pass but the ball travels towards the passer's DBL (or flat))

    what he's interested in is whether you would call it as such during a game?

  10. #80

    Advises in England
    OB..'s Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Glos & District
    Grade
    Adviser (grass roots)
    Join Date
    07 Oct 04
    Posts
    22,305
    Thanks (Received)
    99
    Likes (Received)
    1416

    Default Re: NO on forward pasess

    Quote Originally Posted by Treadmore View Post
    not sure why you're struggling with this OB, crossref has just reversed the usual momentum situation (and it is a foward pass but the ball travels towards the passer's DBL (or flat))

    what he's interested in is whether you would call it as such during a game?
    I am trying to get crossref to accept that the passes are forward even if many refs would (mistakenly) not blow for them. He is ducking.

    His attempt to "prove" my statement wrong fails.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •