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Thread: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

      
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    Default No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    https://drive.google.com/open?id=1gp...dI8_CHct0DqrW_

    Interesting debating point came up whilst I was watching this game.
    I've changed my mind over this and interested as to how you would ref it.

    In real-time , watching the game live I saw : Ball-carrier falls to ground, his team-mate stands over him, defender realises there is no ruck and there has been no tackle so is free to come round and take the ball. Ref was incorrect to penalise him for side-entry/offside.

    However, when I watch it again ( with the beneift of slow-mo ), you could argue that the defender has placed his hand on the player as he was on the ground so , in effect, a tackle HAS indeed been completed. Ref was correct to spot the "technical-tackle" and so PK was correct call.

    Which way round is it ?
    Cheers.

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    Rugby Club Member Treadmore's Avatar

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    The video doesn't start soon enough to show how the ball carrier was brought to ground.

    If there was no more contact from the defender than that shown then if the ball carrier got to his feet I wouldn't have been surprised if the ref called "not held" i.e. no tackle.

    Whether tackled or not, the ball is placed beyond the back foot of the supporting team mate. So did the defender assume that the ball was "out" i.e. any possible TWOL was now over?

    There's a chance the ref blew for it (if this is what he did call) because it looked wrong.

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Treadmore View Post
    The video doesn't start soon enough to show how the ball carrier was brought to ground.
    Just what I was thinking.

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    A TWOL is over when the "ball leaves the tackle area". Arguably the ball was still in the tackle area.

    (Aside ..The back foot is not the offside line for a TWOL .. or indeed for a ruck)

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    Rugby Club Member Rich_NL's Avatar

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    A tackle isn't a ruck, you need more than contact. Defender has to hold the BC while they're on their feet, then BC goes off feet - tackle made.

    I agree with crossref - if the ball is placed it's still in the tackle area. That would be strange if not.

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    For me there is no tackle, but as others have said might have been "brought to ground" before the video starts, that said that ball is out of the "ruck". It's beyond the "hind most point", play on!
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    Rugby Club Member Rich_NL's Avatar

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    If it had been a tackle, would you consider blue 3 to have come through the gate?

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_NL View Post
    If it had been a tackle, would you consider blue 3 to have come through the gate?
    Yes I would.

    His right foot looks to be in front of bloke on the floor's face. Not C&O "in the side" for me.
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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_NL View Post
    If it had been a tackle, would you consider blue 3 to have come through the gate?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Lifeson-Peart View Post
    Yes I would. His right foot looks to be in front of bloke on the floor's face. Not C&O "in the side" for me.
    Really?

    You do realise that Green are playing from right to left and not top to bottom don't you! If we assume that WAS a tackle, that would be one of the most blatant "in from the side" offences all season.

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    Default Re: No-tackle. Can offside lines be estabilshed by being over the ball ?

    FWIW - The ball carrier did not get any contact. He was falling to ground and indeed was on the ground when the defender put his hand on him. So, a tackle has not been completed. Hence the question : "How can there be TWOL without the tackle in the first place? "

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