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Thread: Tackle change

      
  1. #21
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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickie E View Post
    when I read the rationale for this it was (IIRC) all about reducing concussions for the tackler (presumably less tacklers = less concussions).

    But less tacklers = less 2 man tacklers = more 1 man tacklers. Surely this then puts a greater physical strain on the lone tackler ???

    And with a guaranteed 1 man overlap to the attacking team (cos the open side winger is now deep to guard the 50:22) there will be fewer structured (i.e. well formed & safer) tackles and more last-gasp, desperate tackles with flailing arms, legs, etc
    A 50:22 kick giving a team put-in to the line-out if they kick into touch indirectly (ie on the bounce) when kicking either from their own half into the opposition 22m or from inside their own 22m to the opposition half. The law aims to force wingers to drop deep out of the defensive line, creating space for the attacker to run the ball.

    The rational appears to be indicated in the beit I'v e highlighted. Nothing to do with the tackle there. Just misguided nonsense.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref
    On the 50:22 does it have the bounce in the oppo 22. Or go onto touch inside the oppo 22? (Or both)




    Quote Originally Posted by OB.. View Post
    Until told otherwise, I will assume it can bounce anywhere in the field of play before going into touch inside the 22.
    Quote Originally Posted by crossref
    And presumably 'taken back' would apply , so you can't take the ball into your own half and then do a 50 22 m kick ?




    .Good point. I would assume so.
    Looking at the Source document:

    A 50:22 kick giving a team put-in to the line-out if they kick into touch indirectly (ie on the bounce) when kicking either from their own half into the opposition 22m or from inside their own 22m to the opposition half. The law aims to force wingers to drop deep out of the defensive line, creating space for the attacker to run the ball.

    It would seem logical t osay the bounce can be anywhere aslong as it goes into touch in the 22.

    Regarding taken back the law already prevents "gain" from doing so. It would be illogical t otreat this experiment differently.

  3. #23
    Player or Coach ChrisR's Avatar

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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Tackles at the waist will have one benefit: As there's no room for a second tackler to smother the ball we'll see more off-loads in the tackle.

    Definitely do not like the 50:22. The intended effect won't happen as intended and it will be a headache for the unassisted refs.

    Instead of the goal line dropout I'd rather move the attacking scrum to the 10m instead of the 5. And, while we're at it move the lineout from the 5m to the 10. Less pushover try attempts and driving mauls.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisR View Post

    Instead of the goal line dropout I'd rather move the attacking scrum to the 10m instead of the 5. And, while we're at it move the lineout from the 5m to the 10. Less pushover try attempts and driving mauls.
    I've never quite understood the "held up ingoal" thing. Elsewhere if you are held up it is "TURNOVER". If you put the ball in goal and it is made dead. (other than scoring) it is turnover ball. Why reward the give that can't get the ball out of the maul?

  5. #25

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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Wakeham View Post
    Nothing to do with the tackle there.
    Below is the preamble to the law changes. The bold bit talks about "greater space" leading to "better player welfare outcomes." How can that be anything other than the tackle? (unless its a mental health outcome when Freddie scores a try that would otherwise have been prevented).

    World Rugby will undertake detailed analysis on a package of law proposals after its three-day player welfare symposium in Paris concluded with delegates submitting evidence-based injury-prevention proposals.
    Leading coaches, match officials, recently retired players, international and domestic competition representatives, game analysis experts, doctors and sports scientists considered the detailed latest shape of the game and injury data before breaking into workshops to consider potential injury-prevention focus areas within the next four-year law amendment review cycle that will begin after Rugby World Cup 2019.
    While community and youth injury rates are comparable to other mass-participation sports, overall elite level injury-rates are not increasing and concussion incidence has decreased by between 10-14 per cent in the last year, the game is united in its commitment to further reduce the risk of injury.
    The latest elite level data confirms that ball in play time has increased by 14 per cent since 2014 and is as high as 41 minutes in some competitions and therefore the number of tackles has also increased. This is significant because the tackle accounts for up to 50 per cent of all match injuries and 76 per cent of all concussions, while 73 per cent of tackle concussions occur to the tackler.
    With the tackle the major focus, the delegates focused on three areas: law change, behaviour change and tackle education. Delegates also considered how the number and type of tackles could be altered and greater space be created to deliver better player welfare outcomes.
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickie E View Post
    Below is the preamble to the law changes. The bold bit talks about "greater space" leading to "better player welfare outcomes." How can that be anything other than the tackle? (unless its a mental health outcome when Freddie scores a try that would otherwise have been prevented).

    Sory I was replying to your answer to :

    Quote Originally Posted by Pablo

    The 50:22 is going to be a challenge with incompetent/biased/disengaged/non-existent club TJs. In terms of merit, I’m unconvinced - I guess the idea is to force a winger to hang back against the possibility of conceding a deep attacking line-out, thereby creating more space further up the pitch. Only way to prove it works is to trial it, but I’m not looking forward to administering it.

    I, therefore, considered you were referring to the 50:22 trial. Obviously the Tackle trial is about the tackcle and related injuries.
    Last edited by Marc Wakeham; 10-08-19 at 09:08.

  7. #27

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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Wakeham View Post
    SI, therefore, considered you were referring to the 50:22 trial.
    I was. Apparently "greater space" (from 50:22) will "deliver better player welfare outcomes".
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Tackle change

    From post #25: Delegates also considered how the number and type of tackles could be altered andgreater space be created to deliver better player welfare outcomes.

    Fuzzy thinking
    Yes, defending a "50:22" threat may move a player from the defensive line to deep but it doesn't create more space. It simply changes where the space is. The space behind the defensive line has always been a target of the well placed kick.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickie E View Post
    I was. Apparently "greater space" (from 50:22) will "deliver better player welfare outcomes".
    50:22 will not reduce the number of tackles. It will change where they occur.

  10. #30

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    Default Re: Tackle change

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Wakeham View Post
    50:22 will not reduce the number of tackles. It will change where they occur.
    I don't think we can possibly know that .. until after we have had a trial



    If teams spend more time kicking the ball backwards and forwards , and less time running at eachother, then it certainly would reduce the number of tackles.

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