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Thread: Charge down & off side

      
  1. #21
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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Seems to be over-complicating things. Intentionally Playing for me would mean catching and passing to a team mate/kicking. Even batting the ball back into the field from touch (jumping and batting it back toward his own DbL). A charge down would be shortly after the kick, for me it doesn't matter where the ball goes goes after that, all kicking team's players are onside and can compete for the loose ball. whether it goes back, forward or to the side after the charge down.

  2. #22

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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Quote Originally Posted by Arabcheif View Post
    Seems to be over-complicating things. Intentionally Playing for me would mean catching and passing to a team mate/kicking. Even batting the ball back into the field from touch (jumping and batting it back toward his own DbL). A charge down would be shortly after the kick, for me it doesn't matter where the ball goes goes after that, all kicking team's players are onside and can compete for the loose ball. whether it goes back, forward or to the side after the charge down.
    after any deliberate touch by Blue, Red are played on side.

    but the question is the 10m Law
    - after a touch the 10m Law still applies
    - after a charge down the 10m Law does not apply

    So we need to have some definition that distinguishes a charge down from any other type of touch.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    10.7.b.(iv) - Intentionally touches the ball without gaining possession of it. The video accompanying this is attempted charge down that goes "back" from the chargers hands.

  4. #24

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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Quote Originally Posted by Arabcheif View Post
    10.7.b.(iv) - Intentionally touches the ball without gaining possession of it. The video accompanying this is attempted charge down that goes "back" from the chargers hands.
    Yes it's an intentional touch (of course) but is it a charge down ?

  5. #25

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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    I am no longer sure what the issue is here. We will all know a charge down when we see one. A successful one may be accompanied by a loud slapping sound, as the force of the kick goes thru’ the outstretched arms and the defender gets a faceful of leather. Successful charge down impies no knock on, so play on. And unsuccessful charge down where the ball goes backwards, is no knock on either, so play on. Only apply the 10m if the attempt is unsuccessful.

    Am I missing something ?
    "We demand strict proof for opinions we dislike, but are satisfied with mere hints for what we’re inclined to accept."
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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Quote Originally Posted by L'irlandais View Post
    Am I missing something ?
    10.4.c The 10-metre law [...] applies if the ball [...] is played by an opponent but not when the kick is charged down.


    So what's the difference between the two?

  7. #27

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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Quote Originally Posted by L'irlandais View Post
    They say a picture tells a thousand words.
    Law 11 has a picture of a charge down
    I would agree, a deflection is not one. In a charge down the ball is blocked and goes toward the kicker’s deadball line. Which would otherwise be a knock-on, except for this exception in Law.

    It is a knock-on when a player, in tackling or attempting to tackle an opponent, makes contact with the ball and the ball goes forward.
    So charge down, retains this need for the ball to go forward.
    If a kick was blocked (direction reversed) but went up rather than down?

    Scrum for knock on?
    PK Intentional knock forward?
    Play on?

  8. #28

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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Doh, successful charge down, no knock on play on.

    Unsuccessful attempt at a charge down, 10 m rule applies.

    I agree with #21, over complicating things. Look for reasons not to blow the whistle. Most teams will give you plenty of valid reasons to stop play, why add unnecessarily to those.
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  9. #29

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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Quote Originally Posted by L'irlandais View Post

    Unsuccessful attempt at a charge down, 10 m rule applies.
    I think that's wrong - I think that the unsuccessful attempt at a chargedown (ie charger gets a touch on it but the ball essentially continues on its way) is exactly when the 10m rule does NOT apply.

    I think that's what the quoted part of 10.4.c is aiming at.


    But it all depends on what you consider to be the definition of a chargedown, and I agree that your view of 10.4.c follows logically from your definition of a chargedown (ie it's only a chargedown if it goes forward from the charger)

    Note that you are going to be blowing your whistle, for 10.4.c infringments, in situations when I am saying 'play on'
    Last edited by crossref; 19-08-19 at 16:08.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Charge down & off side

    Top Tip -
    I've often watched refs , at much higher level than mine, who shout "Touched !" after an attempted charge-down ( where the ball glances a finger-tip of an attempted charge-down but still goes forward and upward). I always thought that a good idea to let everyone know that I have seen it and it's play-on as there will be no offsides from that kick.

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