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Thread: Uncontested scrums

      
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    Referees in Sri Lanka


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    Default Uncontested scrums

    A match is payed under wet and soggy underfoot conditions . The ground is also uneven .

    This is an under 19 game .

    Three minutes into the first half and second scrum takes place and the front row collapses and a layer has a bad injury.The first scrum too was not steady .

    Considering the bad underfoot conditions referee declares uncontested scrums .

    He opined that this is the interest of player safety . Declared squad is w 25 as per tournament rules . Thee were subs available

    Is the declaration of uncontested scrums by referee correct.
    Vimal Perera

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    Referees in Australia
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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    Absolutely. Player safety paramount. You can't force a team to make a sub to try to solve the issue.

    Normally if scrums are a mess (eg dominant scrum) I'll ask players to depower. If they refuse, I'll comfortably go uncontested.

    I always find it sobering to consider what I would say if I was in the box in the coroner's court.
    Last edited by Dickie E; 09-06-19 at 01:06.
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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    Without knowing more information, I wouldn't second guess the referee. He's a lot closer to it than I am.
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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    I think it would have to be done with the agreement of both captains, if one or both refuse then the game should be abandoned as it is not safe to play. You cannot change probable outcomes by restructuring a game due to weather, without both sides agreeing.

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    Referees in England


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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    I think it would have to be done with the agreement of both captains, if one or both refuse then the game should be abandoned as it is not safe to play. You cannot change probable outcomes by restructuring a game due to weather, without both sides agreeing.
    If they played on then they accepted it
    If a team didn't accept it they could stop playing
    Last edited by crossref; 09-06-19 at 07:06.

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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    I think it would have to be done with the agreement of both captains, if one or both refuse then the game should be abandoned as it is not safe to play. You cannot change probable outcomes by restructuring a game due to weather, without both sides agreeing.
    I must say it would never occur to me to ask the teams for permission to go uncontested
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    Referees in New Zealand


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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    I think it would have to be done with the agreement of both captains, if one or both refuse then the game should be abandoned as it is not safe to play. You cannot change probable outcomes by restructuring a game due to weather, without both sides agreeing.
    I don't agree with that at all. If the conditions mean that the game is unsafe to be played with contested scrums, that is a call for the ref to make. Players have to get on with what the ref says.

    Now the ref might be wrong in making his determination that scrums are unsafe, but that is another issue.
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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    A refere may order uncontested scrums at any time. He call is not open to discussion. "Referee is sole judge of fact" and all that.

    Law justification?

    Well I'd go for:

    3.13
    Scrums will become uncontested if
    either team cannot field a suitably trained front row
    or
    if the referee so orders


    I think that refutes the "consent" argument.

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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    With my coaches head on, if I've got a dominant scrum in an important game and due to weather conditions the referee says we are going uncontested due to safety concerns, I could/would take my team off. A game would never start where scrums were unsafe without consent and in reality they would not continue without consent. I would not worry about defending that decision or expect sanction. I could argue my case on many levels. The referee may "so order" whatever he wants, he only gets it if the game continues, for that he would in effect need consent.

  10. #10

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    Default Re: Uncontested scrums

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside View Post
    With my coaches head on, if I've got a dominant scrum in an important game and due to weather conditions the referee says we are going uncontested due to safety concerns, I could/would take my team off. A game would never start where scrums were unsafe without consent and in reality they would not continue without consent. I would not worry about defending that decision or expect sanction. I could argue my case on many levels. The referee may "so order" whatever he wants, he only gets it if the game continues, for that he would in effect need consent.
    If one scrum is too dominant, the standard advice is for the refere to ask them to "dominate but not destroy". If they can't manage that and the referee judges the situation to be unsafe, he is expected to go to uncontested scrums. Safety is the referee's call. If the coach chooses to take his team off, that is his prerogative, but I don't see that it does his team much good.
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