Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 23

Thread: Foot on the Line

      
  1. #1
    Rugby Club Member

    Soc/Assoc
    None
    Grade
    None
    Join Date
    18 Mar 19
    Posts
    5
    Thanks (Received)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default Foot on the Line

    I am a bit confused by a decision from the NZ/Wales thrid-place match. Obviously it was the correct decision as all officials agreed and TV commentators didn't query it, so I am wondering what I am missing.

    Wales kicked from outside their 22, and Jordie Barrett went to catch it. He put his foot on the touchline, and clearly expected the decision to be a scrum back. However, the AR awarded a lineout ... to Wales. (I don't think Barrett stepped into touch after he caught it, although he may have - I wasn't paying close attention.) Wayne Barnes ran up, checked with the AR and said something like "Foot on the line, in play".

    If it was "in play", then why was a lineout given at all ... unless of course Barrett DID step into touch after he caught it? If Barrett's foot had been over the touchline when he caught the ball, would it have been a scrum back? And if on the line is in play, then why is a try given when the ball is grounded on the goalline, or are the laws different there? And what about the deadball line when a kick is going dead? If the receiving player has his foot on the line in this instance is it still "in play", so that he needs to go over the line again here?

    Finally, while on this general topic, one that has baffled me for ages. If a missed drop-goal attempt goes dead, why is it not a scrum back? Is there a special exemption for drop-goal attempts? And if so, would anyone agree that the law should be changed? It seems very generous to reward a missed drop-goal by allowing the team that missed to regain possession via a drop out, and encourages teams to run down the clock with an endless series of drop-goal efforts.

    Thanks in advance.

  2. #2

    Referees in England
    Phil E's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Staffordshire and Royal Navy
    Grade
    8
    Join Date
    22 Jan 08
    Posts
    14,883
    Thanks (Received)
    158
    Likes (Received)
    1286
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    If he caught the ball while standing on the touchline then the decision was correct. The touchline is part of in touch.

    TOUCH OR TOUCH-IN-GOAL
    1. The ball is in touch or touch-in-goal when :
    a. The ball or ball-carrier touches the touchline, touch-in-goal line or anything
    beyond.
    b. A player, who is already touching the touchline, touch-in-goal line or anything
    beyond, catches or holds the ball
    .



    The goal line is part of in-goal, so a ball on the goal line is in-goal...and a try if its the oppositions goal line.


    The deadball line is the same as a touchline...it's out.


    For you last question, look at the last part of this law:

    BALL KICKED DEAD THROUGH IN-GOAL
    12. If a team kicks the ball through their opponents’ in-goal from the field of play into touchin-
    goal or on or over the dead-ball line, the defending team can choose :
    a. To have a drop-out anywhere on or behind the 22-metre line; or
    b. To have a scrum at the place where the ball was kicked.
    Exception : An unsuccessful kick at goal or attempted dropped goal. In these cases, the
    defending team restarts with a 22-metre drop-out.

    Follow my Award Winning blog The Rugby Ref


  3. #3

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    --
    Grade
    Grassroots
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    17,692
    Thanks (Received)
    137
    Likes (Received)
    1743

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    What Phil missed out is the recent change in the Law

    Until very recently when the catcher of the ball has a foot in touch , the kicker would be judged to have put the ball in touch, and the catcher would get the throw

    They changed the Law a year or so ago , so that it now depends on whether the ball had crossed the plane of the touchline or not . In this case it hadn't, so the catcher was judged to have put the ball in touch. Lineout to the kicker

    If Barrett was expecting the throw, that was a bad mistake

    On the other hand he might have simply stepped on the line accidentally !
    Last edited by crossref; 1 Week Ago at 18:11.

  4. #4

    Referees in America
    smeagol's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    CARFU RS
    Join Date
    20 Apr 12
    Posts
    394
    Thanks (Received)
    3
    Likes (Received)
    18

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    On the other hand he might have simply stepped on the line accidentally !
    From my recollection, Barrett's body language indicated that he was unaware of the change in law. His foot on the line seemed deliberate, and he motioned as if expecting the lineout upfield.

  5. #5

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    --
    Grade
    Grassroots
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    17,692
    Thanks (Received)
    137
    Likes (Received)
    1743

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    Quote Originally Posted by smeagol View Post
    From my recollection, Barrett's body language indicated that he was unaware of the change in law. His foot on the line seemed deliberate, and he motioned as if expecting the lineout upfield.
    Well a bad mistake.
    Oddly I had a similar incident in a grass roots game a few weeks ago and even at my lowly level the mistaken player received DotD for not knowing about that change ..

    (although in fairness part of the reason was no doubt they way he ostentatiously placed his foot on the line and leaned right in the catch the ball a good 1.5m in !)

  6. #6

    Referees in England
    Phil E's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Staffordshire and Royal Navy
    Grade
    8
    Join Date
    22 Jan 08
    Posts
    14,883
    Thanks (Received)
    158
    Likes (Received)
    1286
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    What Phil missed out is the recent change in the Law
    I didn't mention that deliberately, so as not to muddy the waters.
    The question was "is it a lineout" not who gets the put in.

    Follow my Award Winning blog The Rugby Ref


  7. #7

    Referees in England


    Soc/Assoc
    --
    Grade
    Grassroots
    Join Date
    14 Sep 09
    Posts
    17,692
    Thanks (Received)
    137
    Likes (Received)
    1743

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil E View Post
    I didn't mention that deliberately, so as not to muddy the waters.
    The question was "is it a lineout" not who gets the put in.
    I thought it was both .. why a lineout and why a Wales throw

    Quote Originally Posted by dfobrien View Post
    I am wondering what I am missing.

    Wales kicked from outside their 22, and Jordie Barrett went to catch it. He put his foot on the touchline, and clearly expected the decision to be a scrum back. However, the AR awarded a lineout ... to Wales. (I don't think Barrett stepped into touch after he caught it, although he may have - I wasn't paying close attention.) .
    Last edited by crossref; 1 Week Ago at 10:11.

  8. #8
    Rugby Club Member Rich_NL's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    Rugby Nederland
    Grade
    WR level 2
    Join Date
    13 Apr 15
    Posts
    1,179
    Thanks (Received)
    18
    Likes (Received)
    316

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    Quote Originally Posted by dfobrien View Post
    If it was "in play", then why was a lineout given at all ... unless of course Barrett DID step into touch after he caught it? If Barrett's foot had been over the touchline when he caught the ball, would it have been a scrum back? And if on the line is in play, then why is a try given when the ball is grounded on the goalline, or are the laws different there? And what about the deadball line when a kick is going dead? If the receiving player has his foot on the line in this instance is it still "in play", so that he needs to go over the line again here?
    I assume he meant the ball was in play (not over the plane of the touchline), his foot being on the line put him in touch - you understand that correctly. Meaning he brought it out, and the lineout goes to the opposition at that point. If it had been straight out, the lineout (not scrum back) would have gone to his team, level with where it was kicked.

    Finally, while on this general topic, one that has baffled me for ages. If a missed drop-goal attempt goes dead, why is it not a scrum back? Is there a special exemption for drop-goal attempts? And if so, would anyone agree that the law should be changed? It seems very generous to reward a missed drop-goal by allowing the team that missed to regain possession via a drop out, and encourages teams to run down the clock with an endless series of drop-goal efforts.
    As stated, there's an exception for drop goals and penalty attempts on goal. I don't think the law needs changing, it rewards an attacking team's attempt to score, and drop goals are a rarity as it is. Certainly at grassroots level, I don't see successful DGs more than once every ten games, almost always within the 22 anyway (so for a second realistic attempt they have to make ground all the way back after the 22DO), and I've never seen anyone use it as a tactic to run down the clock.

  9. #9

    Referees in Australia
    Dickie E's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    VRRA
    Grade
    Level 2
    Join Date
    19 Jan 07
    Posts
    12,397
    Thanks (Received)
    110
    Likes (Received)
    1312

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    is this the one where he thinks he is jumping from FoP to knock ball back in but actually starts with foot on touchline? Some video would help
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  10. #10

    Resident Club Coach
    didds's Avatar

    Soc/Assoc
    N/A
    Grade
    Club Coach
    Join Date
    27 Jan 04
    Posts
    9,667
    Thanks (Received)
    63
    Likes (Received)
    930

    Default Re: Foot on the Line

    dickie - he is stock still with foot on the line and just lets the ball come to him, but he catches it in the field of play.

    dont have a video ref Im afraid.

    didds

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •