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Taff
16-03-18, 14:03
Our U15 boys are on a mini tour to London this weekend, and I needed to clarify the differences in law at that level.

I have been told that lifting is allowed at LOs but that all LOs must be uncontested. I assume the sanction is a FK - correct?

Are there any other differences we need to be aware of? Eg are No 8s in England allowed to pick up? :chin:

Flish
16-03-18, 15:03
That's about it really, scrum half can't move beyond the half way line of the scrum, 30 min games (6 min yellows), few games I've done at this level I've made a point of calling 'over' when the feet hit the ground after the lift in the line.

didds
16-03-18, 15:03
http://www.englandrugby.com/mm/Document/MyRugby/Education/01/32/87/30/RFURegulation152017-2018_Neutral.pdf
http://www.englandrugby.com/mm/Document/MyRugby/Education/01/32/87/32/AgeGradeCodesofPracticeMarch18_Neutral.pdf
http://www.englandrugby.com/mm/Document/General/General/01/32/72/59/RFURegulation15Appendix9_English.pdf


That should cover it. The third pdf is the most pertinent/specific but should be read in conjunction with the other two. As a basic rule of thumb if something isn't specified in those three then its the standard laws of the game.

have a great trip :-)

didds

ChuckieB
16-03-18, 15:03
Check with the ref as to how familiar they are with some of the variations. You may even have three different undrstandings! if in further doubt check out how they are likely to apply the laws in certain cases. As far as the scrum is concerned they are likely to police the 45deg. wheel and the 1.5m push with more attention (as a safety issue) than they are the SH creeping beyond the middle line (developmental issue - more chance to enable play to develop unhindered). I saw this question asked once at u15 but effectively forgotten in the heat of the contest.

Taff
16-03-18, 16:03
That's about it really, scrum half can't move beyond the half way line of the scrum ...
Good. I didn't know that.


That should cover it. The third pdf is the most pertinent/specific but should be read in conjunction with the other two. As a basic rule of thumb if something isn't specified in those three then its the standard laws of the game.
Brilliant. Thanks Didds.


Check with the ref as to how familiar they are with some of the variations.
There have been some developments; and they have asked if I would Ref one of the games. Apparently they can't get a Ref for our game on Sunday.

I have spoken to the lady at the WRU and she said I needed to get an e-mail to confirm that I am covered under their Clubs insurance. I have been told that they have checked with the RFU and it's OK, but I haven't had an e-mail yet. I won't be doing anything without an e-mail. :knuppel2:

didds
16-03-18, 18:03
You are as I understand it covered under the RFU's insurance as a referee in England at a RFU affiliated club etc.

However, that would require you to ref to RFU rules and regs etc, (or less stringent variations eg if lifting was allowed but you agreed that nobody lifts ie a "downgrade" so to speak. purely an example).

however, I would understand your reticence entirely.

didds

crossref
16-03-18, 18:03
In England a club can appoint anyone they think suitable to coach or referee their teams . You are then acting as an official of the club, and covered by the club's insurance in the same way as the coaches and the dad-who-refs

So if you need to actually see a certificate of insurance it's the home club you need to ask, they have appointing you.

The RFU have determined that referee don't have to be DBS checked (criminal record etc)

Don't use the ref changing room unless it's completely separate from the boys changing rooms. Be prepared for there to be nowhere for you to change or shower, as all the changing areas may be in use by the kids. So go in your kit

Do you need permission from the WRU to ref abroad ?

menace
17-03-18, 00:03
More importantly do you have permission from your wife (or mum)!

Uncontested lineouts at u15???? :holysheep::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf:
England must just about have run out of cotton wool now.:sarc::sarc::sarc::biggrin:

Taff
17-03-18, 01:03
More importantly do you have permission from your wife (or mum)!
My wife can't wait for me to go. She's packed my kit bag and everything. I know what she's up to; she just wants the double bed to herself. :biggrin:


Uncontested lineouts at u15???? :holysheep:
I think they start contested LOs at U16 in England. When we did the tour about 8 years ago, our U15's played the London Welsh U16s because the coaches wanted contested LOs. In fact IIRC Cody Cuxman was the Referee that game.

didds
18-03-18, 07:03
More importantly do you have permission from your wife (or mum)!

Uncontested lineouts at u15???? :holysheep::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf:
England must just about have run out of cotton wool now.:sarc::sarc::sarc::biggrin:

1st season of lifting. Uncontested so players hone skills . The throw still has to be straight, and timed to reach the catcher, and once feet are on the floor its game on.

menace
18-03-18, 10:03
1st season of lifting. Uncontested so players hone skills . The throw still has to be straight, and timed to reach the catcher, and once feet are on the floor its game on.

Thats what training is for?

crossref
18-03-18, 14:03
How did it go, Taff ?

Taff
18-03-18, 22:03
... Don't use the ref changing room unless it's completely separate from the boys changing rooms. Be prepared for there to be nowhere for you to change or shower, as all the changing areas may be in use by the kids. So go in your kit

How did it go, Taff ?
After all that, the game was called off due to the overnight snow. Pity, because I was really looking forward to it after checking and making sure I understood the English variations. :frown:

We played London Welsh U15s on Saturday - and won 53 - 7. Brilliant hospitality before and after the game. We stayed in the clubhouse to watch the last 2 Six Nations game.

We were due to play Richmond U15s today; so I assumed a prestigious ground like the Richmond Athletic Club would have a room for me. :biggrin: Text this morning though to say "Not unsurprisingly, following a pitch inspection, all mini and youth activity at the ground today is CANCELLED due to snow and ice". I never played on the Athletic ground, so to Ref on it would have been an honour. Never mind; if they don't bring a combined team to West Wales next season, we may travel up again, so I may still get my chance.

Fair play to the RFU, even though I'd rung them direct at 4:20pm on a Friday before a 6 Nations game and I must say they were brilliant. :clap: If I'm honest when the lady said someone would ring me back, I was expecting to get nowhere so late in the day and on a day when they must have been busy, but a lady did ring me back personally and said I was clear to take charge and would be covered under their insurance policy.

crossref
18-03-18, 22:03
We were due to play Richmond U15s today; so I assumed a prestigious ground like the Richmond Athletic Club would have a room for me. :biggrin: =.

they have an officials' room - with a shower cubicle in the corner :-(

I still remember once reffing London Scottish 4th (or something) having the room to myself after the game, climbing into that shower, and then the moment I got in the cubicle the door opened and into the room came Andrew Small (who was reffing Richmond 1st), 2 x AR, 2 x RFU Match observers someone from the club with a plate of biscuits...

Let's just say I didn't spend too long soaping...

ChuckieB
19-03-18, 01:03
After all that, the game was called off due to the overnight snow. Pity, because I was really looking forward to it after checking and making sure I understood the English variations. :frown:

We played London Welsh U15s on Saturday - and won 53 - 7. Brilliant hospitality before and after the game. We stayed in the clubhouse to watch the last 2 Six Nations game.

We were due to play Richmond U15s today; so I assumed a prestigious ground like the Richmond Athletic Club would have a room for me. :biggrin: Text this morning though to say "Not unsurprisingly, following a pitch inspection, all mini and youth activity at the ground today is CANCELLED due to snow and ice". I never played on the Athletic ground, so to Ref on it would have been an honour. Never mind; if they don't bring a combined team to West Wales next season, we may travel up again, so I may still get my chance.

Fair play to the RFU, even though I'd rung them direct at 4:20pm on a Friday before a 6 Nations game and I must say they were brilliant. :clap: If I'm honest when the lady said someone would ring me back, I was expecting to get nowhere so late in the day and on a day when they must have been busy, but a lady did ring me back personally and said I was clear to take charge and would be covered under their insurance policy.

doubt you would have played on the main pitch, probably one of the surrounding pitches.

Taff
19-03-18, 14:03
doubt you would have played on the main pitch, probably one of the surrounding pitches.
I wouldn't have minded either way, but for the last trip London Welsh let us play on their main pitch. In fact I think they suggested we play on it again this year, but their 1st Team had a pretty important match against the Bank of England, which overlapped our time, so they obviously took priority. Report HERE (http://www.londonwelshrfc.com/teams/185416/match-centre/1-2837891)

Camquin
19-03-18, 15:03
I would say that 1st team always get first dibs on the main pitch at any club.
Not sure about West London but here in Cambridge ground was frozen solid on Sunday.
So whichever pitch you would have been on would have been off.