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Thread: Boot on body

      
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    Default Boot on body

    Following on from other discussions on this topic, wich I cannot immediately find:

    Scotland v PI 25 minutes gone, Scotland have attacking ruck. PI player reaches over and grabs ball, ref calls advantage.

    Scottish player applies boot to arm/hand of PI player to release ball and play continues.

    At breakdown, ref returns to spot, penalises PI player and yellow cards him.

    My question, gentlemen: should he then have reversed the penalty and considered a card for the Scottish player?

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    of course he should have.

    Once again you blokes at the coal face are savagely let down by your alleged betters.

    didds

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    Quote Originally Posted by Glyndwr View Post
    Scotland v PI 25 minutes gone, Scotland have attacking ruck. PI player reaches over and grabs ball, ref calls advantage.

    Scottish player applies boot to arm/hand of PI player to release ball and play continues.

    At breakdown, ref returns to spot, penalises PI player and yellow cards him.

    My question, gentlemen: should he then have reversed the penalty and considered a card for the Scottish player?
    What do you consider the Scottish player to have done wrong exactly? He rucked the ball. That is stll legal.

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    Or did he stamp on a player?? You decide...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacko View Post
    Or did he stamp on a player?? You decide...
    His foot made contact with the ball, that to me is rucking. You are allowed to get the ball with your foot in a ruck. The contact with the player's arm is the same as if you move a player on the ground with your boot. If you ban what the Scottish player did you would be outlawing rucking as far as I can see.
    The only other person to make a mistake in that ruck was the referee who allowed the sitution to continue so long without blowing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycee
    The contact with the player's arm is the same as if you move a player on the ground with your boot.
    Moving a player with your foot is illegal.

    Incidental, unintentional contact when rucking the ball is legal, unless reckless or dangerous.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

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    Quote Originally Posted by OB.. View Post
    Moving a player with your foot is illegal.

    Incidental, unintentional contact when rucking the ball is legal, unless reckless or dangerous.
    I should have said moving the player whilst playing the ball, knew what I meant typed something else.Obviously moving a player with your boot who is not in contact with the ball would be illegal. Thanks for the clarification.

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    Should have penalized the player for boots, the same way that Walsh pinged Richards for mountain climbing all over the Bok player today.

    Now whether the Bok player should have been allowed to be there anyway is another question, but Walsh was absolutely correct to penalize Richards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehookah View Post
    Should have penalized the player for boots, the same way that Walsh pinged Richards for mountain climbing all over the Bok player today.

    Now whether the Bok player should have been allowed to be there anyway is another question, but Walsh was absolutely correct to penalize Richards.
    I agree. Would I be right in saying that in the past this would have probably been a pen to england for the bok being on the wrong side, but with a little warning to richards to be careful? That how it always seemed to me at that level, which was never any help to us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycee View Post
    I should have said moving the player whilst playing the ball, knew what I meant typed something else.Obviously moving a player with your boot who is not in contact with the ball would be illegal. Thanks for the clarification.
    Jaycee, I'd be interested to have some more of your perspective on rucking, given your relatively exalted grading. There still seems to be an awful lot of variation in the way the "boots on bodies" law is applied, and of course some of that is down the skill levels of both players and refs.

    Reading your post, it seems that at Level 6, a player on the ground in contact with the ball both expects, and receives with impugnity, a bit of a shoeing as part and parcel of the game. I'm struggling to imagine a man on the ground being moved by a player who is rucking the ball - technically, how does this happen?

    All would surely agree that "moving a player with your boot who is not in contact with the ball would be illegal". In this case, the player on the ground was apparently in contact with the ball, and his arm was targetted by the ruckign player to remove its grip on the ball ("Scottish player applies boot to arm/hand of PI player to release ball and play continues."). At Level 11, I would ping that as rucking the man, not the ball, and depending on the proximity of the boot to the joint, might YC the rucker. Would I be right in thinking that you'd take a different view at L.6?

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