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Thread: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

      
  1. #261
    Rugby Club Member Flish's Avatar

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    See post #248

  2. #262

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    Quote Originally Posted by Flish View Post
    See post #248
    I think Arabcheif is asking you to define ‘reckless and dangerous’ in such a way that we can all apply it. It’s subjective so therefore impossible.
    He was guilty of ‘reckless and dangerous’ by the weight of public opinion about what felt correct even if it wasn’t in law.
    It’s a matter of opinion whether a ball carrier is acting in such a manner. But generally speaking if a ball carrier is running with force then you expect a tackler to use at least an equal amount of force to tackle him. You as a ref decide at the moment as to what is legal and then if necessary leave it up to the disciplinary committee to decide if you were right. Unfortunately not everyone has a video to refer to.
    Last edited by Balones; 01-10-21 at 21:10.

  3. #263
    Rugby Club Member Flish's Avatar

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    I fleshed that out (IMO) in #236, the main cue for me was him
    diving superman style into the tackle, literally out of control at that point

  4. #264

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    it's a bit like pornography ... I can't define it, but I know it when I see it
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  5. #265

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    As ArabCheif says, in theory, almost every tackle is dangerous, and those at speed - ball carrier or tackler - even more so.

    So it seems that this tackle wasn't simply dangerous, it was excessively dangerous/reckless. Where is the line from "acceptably" to "reckless"? Good question, and difficult to draw.

    As I said in an earlier post, my real issue is how it has been treated. 24 weeks starting point is just laughable. It seems to me that the Disciplinary system is broken.

    Are we meant to use intent? Jordie Barrett would suggest not, nor the other South African citing for charging into the ruck.
    Are we to use dangerousness? Well, there's a mixed bag of thoughts there. This case suggests yes; the two other cases suggest not. The Quins winger case suggests so.
    Is it outcome based or input based? No settled views here.

    There's a trend starting to emerge of inconsistencies in how these things are treated, and I'm not sure for the better. SANZAAR in particular are leading the way in, I think, increasing risk to players.
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  6. #266

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    Quote Originally Posted by SimonSmith View Post
    Is it outcome based or input based? No settled views here.

    There's a trend starting to emerge of inconsistencies in how these things are treated, and I'm not sure for the better. SANZAAR in particular are leading the way in, I think, increasing risk to players.
    In the charging into the ruck incident there was even a mitigation comment made by the judiciary that the incident wasn't all that serious because the Australians didn't remonstrate at the time. WTF?
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  7. #267

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    Everything is subjective, but in my opinion the player was not even trying to perform a tackle, he saw an opportunity to hurt an opponent, in a reckless act disguised as a tackle.

    That's my starting point, which obviously is not shared by everyone

    Totally accept it's subjective
    Last edited by crossref; 02-10-21 at 10:10.

  8. #268

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    I think it was a deliberate act to hurt an opponent via a tackle. No disguise. I also think it is something that tacklers do quite often. It just so happens that in the realm of subjectivity this one was a step too far.

  9. #269

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    Default Re: South African schoolboy rugby viral tackle video

    Quote Originally Posted by Balones View Post
    I think it was a deliberate act to hurt an opponent via a tackle. No disguise. I also think it is something that tacklers do quite often. It just so happens that in the realm of subjectivity this one was a step too far.
    I think at some point WR will introduce an generalised 'excessive force' law. It's odd that we have the concept of a hand-off that is illegal because of 'excessive force' but no other action has that qualification

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