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Thread: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

      
  1. #21

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Kicked by Black.
    Green player puts his arms in the air to charge down and the ball is deflected.
    At that point all the black players are onside...play on.

    It did look wrong, but I believe the referee got it right. Although I don't think he was sure to start with, as the ball passes him he just walks after it even after the player collects it and runs up-field. There is a pause before he runs after him as if he is thinking it through.

    charge down.jpg
    Last edited by Phil E; 24-08-20 at 08:08.

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Yeagh - Im with PhilE. Though I can fully understand some other viewpoint as the alws dont actually define what a charge down is. I(t does of course "look wrong" - and TBH any player in itoje's position would risk the PK anyway even if unsure themselves.

    didds

  3. #23

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Aussie rules use the term "touched in flight" which covers all intentional contact after a kick apart from trying to catch the ball as it alights. I reckon that's what I'd use to rule on "downtown" offside
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  4. #24

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    That clarification doesnt seem right to me ,

    .. I think the definition of a handoff is too strict
    .. the 10m Law is about being within 10m of where the ball lands or is caught, but they keep talking about being 10m from the kick


    (Aside for me this incident was a chargedown, the 10m law did not apply and try was good)
    Last edited by crossref; 24-08-20 at 11:08.

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickie E View Post
    Aussie rules use the term "touched in flight" which covers all intentional contact after a kick apart from trying to catch the ball as it alights. I reckon that's what I'd use to rule on "downtown" offside
    Yep, I agree.

    In rugby (both codes) its not uncommon to hear referees yell "touched" to let all players know that downfield players don't have to retire and are free to play the ball.

    Quote Originally Posted by crossref View Post
    That clarification doesnt seem right to me ,

    .. the 10m Law is about being within 10m of where the ball lands or is caught, but they keep talking about being 10m from the kick
    Nor me. I think they misconstrued the ARU's question - their answer was unrelated to what the ARU were asking.
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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Quote Originally Posted by didds View Post
    Yeagh - Im with PhilE. Though I can fully understand some other viewpoint as the alws dont actually define what a charge down is.
    11 Knock-on or throw forward
    KNOCK-ON
    5.The ball is not knocked-on, and play continues, if.

    a. A player knocks the ball forward immediately after an opponent has kicked it (charge down).

    .............. a charge down is a type of knock on according to this law, it is only description in law..........

    There is also a picture showing downward movement of the ball, hence a "chargedown"

    I think we are screwed, all we have is precedence

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    yeah get that... but... if A kicks the ball, B jumps and half blocks it so it changes direction significantly, goes down but behind B ... that hasnt gone forwards... but is it a charge down? If a CD requires the ball to go forward then no. But it significantly altered the glight of the ball nonetheless etc

  8. #28

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Quote Originally Posted by didds View Post
    yeah get that... but... if A kicks the ball, B jumps and half blocks it so it changes direction significantly, goes down but behind B ... that hasnt gone forwards... but is it a charge down? If a CD requires the ball to go forward then no. But it significantly altered the glight of the ball nonetheless etc
    That is the rub.

    According to the applicable law and not to tradition, the 10m law applies

    4.An offside player may be penalised, if that player:

    a.Interferes with play; or

    b. Moves forwards towards the ball; or

    c. Was in front of a team-mate who kicked the ball and fails to retire immediately behind an onside team-mate or an imaginary line across the field 10 metres on that player’s side from where the ball is caught or lands, even if it hits a goal post or crossbar first. If this involves more than one player, then the player closest to where the ball lands or is caught is the one penalised. This is known as the 10-metre law and still applies if the ball touches or is played by an opponent but not when the kick is charged down.



    I'd win the argument in a court of law, but not in court of old grumpy refs

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Thanks for all inputs so far !
    There seems a general acceptance that the law should be re-written.
    I'm no legal expert, but let's see if I can have a version 0.1....

    Definitions : Add a definition of a charge-down :
    A charge-down occurs when a defending player approaches an opposing kicker with an intent to deflect the path of the kicked-ball after it has been propelled by the kicker. The defender must have touched the ball and the ball may be deflected in any direction (including no discernible change in direction ). The blocker must have made contact with the kicked-ball close the the kicker.
    A charge-down is not a knock-on

    Law 10.4 c :
    Was in front of a team-mate who kicked the ball and fails to retire immediately behind an onside team-mate or an imaginary line across the field 10 metres on that player’s side from where the ball is caught or lands, even if it hits a goal post or crossbar first. If this involves more than one player, then the player closest to where the ball lands or is caught is the one penalised. This is known as the 10-metre law and still applies if the ball is touched by an opponent (who is nearer to the place of ball-landing than the place of the kick) but not when the kick is touched as part of a charge-down.

    Sanction: The non-offending team can choose either:
    <blah blah>

    Nope. That's not quite what I was after,either. I need help here, people !
    Anyone good at writing laws ?

  10. #30

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    Default Re: Why isn't this offisde under 10m law ?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrouchTPEngage View Post

    Nope. That's not quite what I was after,either. I need help here, people !
    Anyone good at writing laws ?
    There used to be a 15 year old from Dublin who wrote laws but I suspect he/she's at least 19 now and has a proper job.
    It's like a big tide of jam coming towards us, but jam made out of old women......Father Dougal McGuire 1998

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