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  1. #21
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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    IRFU gave specific clarification on this in recent years.
    Any step towards or away from the ball or indeed sideways is to be judged to be the beginning of the approach and a charge is permitted.....my words not theirs.

  2. #22

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_Cook View Post
    This law is probably unchanged since it was written, ...
    The earliest form of conversion involved a complicated application of the Free Kick procedure, but that was simplified in 1883. Thereafter there was a placer and a kicker. Some older readers (such as me) may recall the days when the the conversion could be charged as soon as the ball touched the ground. Therefore it was necessary for the scrum half to lie on the ground with one finger on top of the ball and one underneath to keep it off the ground until just before the full back kicked it.

    Some time between 1949 and 1959 the need for a separate placer was dropped, and the current problems started.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

  3. #23

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    Quote Originally Posted by Decorily View Post
    IRFU gave specific clarification on this in recent years.
    Any step towards or away from the ball or indeed sideways is to be judged to be the beginning of the approach and a charge is permitted.....my words not theirs.
    IRFU?

    OK, I may have used the wrong acronym. maybe it was IRFB (what the IRB was previously called)

    As far as I can find, there is no World Rugby Clarification on this law. I have always understood that approach in the laws means what it means in English... "move towards".

    Usually, when the laws use a word to mean something specific, or are using to mean something other than the common English meaning, its in the definitions.. examples

    Near: Within one metre.
    Receiver: The player in a position to receive the ball if it is knocked or passed back from a lineout.
    Touch: The area alongside the field of play that includes the touchlines and beyond.
    Maul: A phase of play consisting of a ball-carrier and at least one player from each team, bound together and on their feet.

    These all have meanings that are specific to the game.


    ETA: OK update. I have found a clarification

    https://www.world.rugby/the-game/law...cation/2020/1/

    "Clarification of the designated members of the Rugby Committee
    The Referee’s interpretation in this example was correct. The moment the kicker moves in any direction it is deemed that he is ‘approaching to kick’. The reason for this interpretation is simplicity, otherwise the referee would have to judge when the kicker first moves, and in what direction. It would also be open to misinterpretation by players, match officials and spectators."


    It changed last year, and I haven't been keeping up... my bad

    Now they just need to define that in the Law... expect to see the change in the 2035 edition of the Laws of the Game!
    Last edited by Ian_Cook; 3 Weeks Ago at 13:09.
    "You can Google for information, but you can't Google for understanding"
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  4. #24
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    I tried to download the new Band-Aid song to support the fundraising to fight Ebola but my anti-virus program wouldn't let me

  5. #25
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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_Cook View Post
    IRFU?



    It changed last year, and I haven't been keeping up... my bad
    !
    No worries. ..hard to 'keep up'!

  6. #26

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_Cook View Post
    IRFU?

    OK, I may have used the wrong acronym. maybe it was IRFB (what the IRB was previously called)

    As far as I can find, there is no World Rugby Clarification on this law. I have always understood that approach in the laws means what it means in English... "move towards".

    Usually, when the laws use a word to mean something specific, or are using to mean something other than the common English meaning, its in the definitions.. examples

    Near: Within one metre.
    Receiver: The player in a position to receive the ball if it is knocked or passed back from a lineout.
    Touch: The area alongside the field of play that includes the touchlines and beyond.
    Maul: A phase of play consisting of a ball-carrier and at least one player from each team, bound together and on their feet.

    These all have meanings that are specific to the game.


    ETA: OK update. I have found a clarification

    https://www.world.rugby/the-game/law...cation/2020/1/

    "Clarification of the designated members of the Rugby Committee
    The Referee’s interpretation in this example was correct. The moment the kicker moves in any direction it is deemed that he is ‘approaching to kick’. The reason for this interpretation is simplicity, otherwise the referee would have to judge when the kicker first moves, and in what direction. It would also be open to misinterpretation by players, match officials and spectators."


    It changed last year, and I haven't been keeping up... my bad

    Now they just need to define that in the Law... expect to see the change in the 2035 edition of the Laws of the Game!
    But that's a different situation. That was a dynamic step that was part of his movement towards the ball. The OP is the kicker taking up his stance prior to moving to kick
    I, for one, like Roman numerals

  7. #27

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    Interesting comment from Bryce Lawrence in the article highlighted in post 24. "Smith's sidestep movement, though Lawrence confirmed, was clearly part of his pre-kick routine, not his 'approach', considering he pauses for an extended period AFTERWARDS as he eyes up the sticks". I have always wondered why NZ players seem to have better skill sets and it appears it is because they possess the gift of foresight unavailable to the rest of the world and can tell exactly what the opposition are going to do next.

  8. #28

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    I think there are only two possible approaches to this

    1 ban charging
    2 referee signals when to charge

    And watching that one it has to be
    1 ban charging

    Anything else is just a referee trap
    Last edited by crossref; 3 Weeks Ago at 13:09.

  9. #29

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    How effective is charging anyway? Does it really affect a kicker's concentration?

    You only really notice it when the kicker does not realise he is judged to have started his approach and gets caught.
    He trudg’d along unknowing what he sought,
    And whistled as he went, for want of thought.
    The Referee by John Dryden

  10. #30

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    Default Re: thoughts on this one

    Quote Originally Posted by OB.. View Post
    How effective is charging anyway? Does it really affect a kicker's concentration?

    You only really notice it when the kicker does not realise he is judged to have started his approach and gets caught.
    what might be more effective, probably would be to do something eye catching ..

    eg instead of charging forward, the defending team could
    -- skip forwards
    -- hop forwards
    -- do the macarena

    I think any of the above (all legal) would have a fair chance at least of distracting the kicker and causing a miss

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