Driven to ground in ruck

[Volun-selected]

Apologies - having a mental block at the moment. Tried a quick search but have missed any previous post.

BC is tackled, tackler releases. First supporting attacker right on the tackler’s heels, comes in and locks on with a solid bind and supports own weight and beats the jackler to the punch. So far, so good.

Next attacking player comes in almost immediately, shoulder into the first player‘s butt driving them over and down and seals on the ruck. The next attacker joins almost immediately and they are both on their feet and locked solid.

But in doing so, between them and the counter ruck, they trap their own man on the ground on the wrong side of the ball and kill any real chance for a clean ruck.

Feels wrong but I cannot ping the first attacker for going deliberately off his feet as he was driven off and over. What is the correct call/law ref/management here?

 

[Dickie E]

I'd have no problem with your scenario as long as the player on ground makes a prompt & genuine effort to exit the ruck east/west

 

[SimonSmith]

Apologies - having a mental block at the moment. Tried a quick search but have missed any previous post.

BC is tackled, tackler releases. First supporting attacker right on the tackler’s heels, comes in and locks on with a solid bind and supports own weight and beats the jackler to the punch. So far, so good.

Next attacking player comes in almost immediately, shoulder into the first player‘s butt driving them over and down and seals on the ruck. The next attacker joins almost immediately and they are both on their feet and locked solid.

But in doing so, between them and the counter ruck, they trap their own man on the ground on the wrong side of the ball and kill any real chance for a clean ruck.

Feels wrong but I cannot ping the first attacker for going deliberately off his feet as he was driven off and over. What is the correct call/law ref/management here?

You're looking at individual culpability. I look at team.

If the offence kills the competition for the ball, there's my decision.

In my head - if the reason for the offence is going to ground is that defence couldn;t bear the ruck, then play on. If they went off feet on their own and kill it, PK

 

[didds]

...

Next attacking player comes in almost immediately, shoulder into the first player‘s butt driving them over and down and seals on the ruck. The next attacker joins almost immediately and they are both on their feet and locked solid.

But in doing so, between them and the counter ruck, they trap their own man on the ground on the wrong side of the ball and kill any real chance for a clean ruck.

Feels wrong but I cannot ping the first attacker for going deliberately off his feet as he was driven off and over. What is the correct call/law ref/management here?

So practice knocking your team mate over to seal the ball and get away with it you mean?

 

[Volun-selected]

So practice knocking your team mate over to seal the ball and get away with it you mean?

After it happened a couple of times in a row it started to feel that way…

But if it keeps happening, who gets the card? And is there a specific ruck law that I’d reference when (inevitably and “politely”) asked about it by the coach, or just 9.4 for killing competition for the ball?

 

[Dickie E]

15.12?

 

[didds]

who gets the card?
You would have had that chat with the captain and/or pack leader by then... "I'm sensing that is a deliberate tactic. I'm reaching the stage where the player off their feet may need to go and have a sit down for ten minutes. Please ensure your players are fully aware".

I don't see what else you can do. except ignore it and reward illegalities.

 

[SimonSmith]

who gets the card?
You would have had that chat with the captain and/or pack leader by then... "I'm sensing that is a deliberate tactic. I'm reaching the stage where the player off their feet may need to go and have a sit down for ten minutes. Please ensure your players are fully aware".

I don't see what else you can do. except ignore it and reward illegalities.

You should take up refereeing Didds!

Exactly the answer I'd give.

 

[Dickie E]

it's similar to an obstruction penalty. Who is the infringer, the obstructor or the ball carrier who uses the obstructor?

 

[didds]

You should take up refereeing Didds!

Exactly the answer I'd give.

This glasshopper has learned well master...

 

[tim White]

Wax on.........

 

[SimonSmith]

This glasshopper has learned well master...

You have done well Padawan.